So, Nintendo has really given up on Wii U. Since they're aware of this. Get to work!
I don't want them next generation saying they were unprepared for it. They should be hard at work on something that is at LEAST as powerful as a XboxOne or ps4 target specifications. If they don't have something ready for 2017 than they have no idea how to make schedules. It sounds like they haven't even started.....sigh

Can't say I'm overly surprised.

Target whatever is a High End gaming PC now and lock in those specs.

Release game?

That would be the best time for it. Launch window works well for hard-core niche games because people are more willing to try stuff due to lack of selection.

If they're not developing new Metroid for the Wii U, then that means they're developing new F-Zero!

...let me be delusional

They've been developing Metroid: Other Other M.
I'd buy it.

Don't let your dreams be dreams.

Not really a huge surprise.  It took 3 years to make Prime 3 and that was a game running on a modified engine of Gamecube games.  Having to make a new engine for the Wii U alone would have made things more complicated, and then there's the fact pretty much everyone who worked on the Prime games has left Retro which would probably slow development as well since Nintendo has to train the current staff of Retro to make a game like this again. 

Only way a Metroid for the Wii U is released is if Retro was working on a 2D one using the Tropical Freeze engine since it would cost less and be quicker for Retro to make.  But for Prime 4, anything less then a 2017 release for the next home console is very unlikely.

I really wish they'd move on from Prime. I'd love to see a new Metroid game, but something legitimately new, not just yet another Prime. For all its faults, Other M tried something different, and I respect it for that.

Well that's a bummer, was hoping to get one on the Wii U, would be great with the gamepad.

This doesn't rule out a more traditional Metroid game on the Wii U. They commented on this last year at E3.

For a metroid game: The worlds on these games are relatively small. The only way to travel around them is on foot. I wouldn't mind seeing a metroid game where the world is gigantic, but every little piece of it is just as brimming as life as prime or super metroid.

like an assassins creed game where you take on bounty targets and you bomb EVERYWHERE to find things. Maybe hunt alien creatures and trade them in for money. Fly from planet to planet. Upgrade your ship. I'm half tempted to say every time you travel to a major planet something happens and you lose your upgrades and have to find the upgrades on the planet.

At "least" as powerful?  How is that is going to fly?  Isn't that just the Wii U?  "Hey everyone here's Nintendo several years late to the party... AGAIN."  No, the NX needs to provide some advantage.  Being adequate isn't gong to matter.

The people in charge are the same and they show no sign of cluing in.  How is Nintendo in 2015 different than Nintendo of the Wii U launch?  I see no difference.  We're all pointing out how they're not offering voice chat in co-op online games and how they just revealed a Metroid game that outright pisses off a good 99% of the Metroid fandom.  Does the Nintendo that has completing botched meeting demand for Amiibos fill you with confidence for the future?  Is their mantra still not "please understand"?

Nothing's changed.  It's the same idiots in charge that are clueless as ever.  The NX will probably be some underpowered gimmick-controller machine like the Wii U because that's all the Iwata-led leadership knows.  They don't know why the Wii U failed.  They're probably focused on something insignificant or they blame it on outside factors.

If Nintendo really got their shit together when it was clear the Wii U was a flop we would already be seeing the effects of it.  The writing was on the wall over a year ago.  The second that disastrous financial report was released everyone not in denial knew the Wii U was finished.  They're not going to figure this stuff out in the one or two years until the NX comes out.

Sony fucked up with the PS3 but clearly has gotten their shit together with the PS4.  That wasn't an overnight process.  The PS3 gradually became a better product as it went on.  You could see that Sony recognized the problems and were doing their best to correct them as the generation went on.  I don't see that with Nintendo but that's what we need to see.

Nintendo has acknowledged that part of the problem was the software lineup, but I don't think just launching a console with games is the solution.

Ian is partially right in that an under-powered machine is going to put them in the same boat.  They end up with developers and publishers shit-talking the console and, more importantly, not putting out the games. 

In terms of the gimmick, I don't think Nintendo will ever let that go.  The Wii was successful because of its gimmick, and they probably view the joystick on the N64 as a gimmick.  But if it's limited in use, then it becomes another hard sell for the console.

But they should have trouble with a new home console anyway.  The question they would have to answer is: why buy the NX when I already own an Xb1 or a PS4?  For the Nintendo games?  Enough people are content to not own a Wii U, but is simply having a few more Nintendo games at launch going to work?  I dunno.  Hope so.

Whatever the NX is, I just hope Nintendo's actually working with Western 3rd party developers in designing it (there's no point in designing the console with Japanese devs in mind. They barely exist anymore). Ignoring Western 3rd party devs in designing the Wii U was probably the single biggest mistake Nintendo made outside of completely failing to produce compelling software early on, so if we once again see a Nintendo console where the likes of Bethesda; EA; Activision; Ubisoft; etc. weren't even consulted in its design, we'll know it's already doomed from the start.

As for the Metroid news, that really does put a perfect cap on what an incredibly disappointing failure the Wii U has turned out to be, doesn't it? No proper Metroid game, no proper 3D Mario game, and probably no proper Zelda game come this time next year.

All four of those devs are assholes. Nintendo should be compatible with their hardware. Not the western dev's bitch.

1 for 3. Good enough for the Baseball Hall of Fame, and the NWR forums...

Whether you like them or not, they are the major players in the 3rd party market, not the nearly-irrelevant Japanese publishers. If Nintendo doesn't consult with them in the design of the NX and design it per where they are going with their games, you can look forward to yet another Nintendo console with pitiful 3rd party support that dies 2-3 years in.

The Wii U doesn't have a Metroid game, 3D World is a largely-multiplayer game more in line with the New Super Mario Bros. series, and Zelda will not be a Wii U game by this time next year. It's so incredibly obvious at this point that that's an NX game, without question.

a couple of things I understand.

Wii was only marginally more powerful than Gamecube. Wii U was only as powerful as a ps3 or xbox 360(it has way more ram, and a better gpu, but the cpu clock-speed is slower). So technically it much more powerful than the other systems, but only if developers don't have lazy programmers. Developers have lazy programmers though. So counter-intiutive. They have to work to make graphics look good, which is something few will do.

Nintendo, when releasing a system has only been really aiming to hit the lowest target, and then there was some sort of newer expensive controller associated with it.

If Nintendo had ps4 graphics and the same controller it would be a home run 2 years from now. Why?
The wall has been hit. What is the wall? Well, what the wall is, is this thing we have been talking about for years. Where games look so good that any future improvements will look marginally different. I had expected this to happen between the ps3 to ps4 systems, but there really was a leap in graphics capabilities.

I don't see games looking so much better than ps4 though. The photo-realism quality of some games is pretty astounding. There has been a cost though. The price of a ps4 and an Xbox One are pretty expensive. I would hope the wii u would go down in price, but the fancy controller is whats hindering any price drops.  The wii u is overpriced. They can't get the price of the console down because the controller is so expensive. If it didn't have such a great controller im sure it would cost $100-$150 less by now.

we can speculate about nx all we want. I just hope it has some power. I hope Nintendo are prepared for the power. Those were things I wanted out of wii u though. On the other hand, the games that have been released on Wii U have all been good. I know Ian is really against the Wii U controller, but honestly if you think its a gimmick than your thinking its the wii controller. Its 95% a traditional controller. 4 face buttons, 2 shoulders, 2 triggers, 2 joysticks, and a d-pad. The only thing different about it is that it has a screen, which major convenience is for inventory/stats/maps.  I think there are a lot of good things about the wii u controller. There are still improvements to be made(the quicklaunch/multitasking could use some improvement)

another prediction Zelda Wii u will be a wii u game, but it will play on nx and launch with nx. There might be an improved version in the way they did Twilight princess. Except, i expect them not to tell us about the nx version until after the wii u version has shipped and been out for 2.5 months. I also imagine it would have some sort of expansion pack DLC. Nintendo seems to have finally succumb to the dlc world. Which, the way they are doing it is pretty positive. They basically are keeping a game alive. Heck Majoras mask followed the same model back in 2000. Except you had to buy a separate cart. Now eshop.

For better or worse there is no Wii U Metroid, however Zelda being on NX or Wii U is not mutually exclusive, and say what you want about 3D world but it is leagues away from the NSMB series in terms of quality. The combination of competent multiplayer and competent game design makes it my favourite Mario game, or at least the Mario game I had most fun playing.

The devs only care about "can we sell this and make a profit?" They don't care whether the port is good or bad as long as it turns in a profit (see all Ubisoft PC games ever). They want a player base established and they want compatible hardware. You don't need to kiss their ass or consult them for it. Some common sense on Nintendo's side goes a long way.

Umm...yes, you DO. http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/199456/Bethesda_Its_too_late_for_thirdparty_support_on_Wii_U.php

That's not me saying Nintendo needs to consult with 3rd parties when developing their hardware. That's BETHESDA saying that.

This thread isn't even about Metroid anymore. Nice job, everyone.

Then we've shown the Metroid franchise the exact same amount of respect that Nintendo has. Maybe now we can have a shitty spin-off thread with the same name coded in Geocities & ASCII Art (the "shitty tech demo" of internet technology).

Just like Nintendo's newest Metroid title.  ba-dumb-tish.

So, Zelda's getting delayed to 2017?

Actually, I suspect NX comes out next Fall, and Zelda's going to be its launch title. Really, what about that pathetic Nintendo Direct Nintendo just did would make you think the Wii U has ANY software releasing next year besides Fire Emblem x SMT? The sales certainly don't give me a reason to think it will, nor Nintendo's focus on 3DS over Wii U. Given Nintendo's pitiful Wii U support lately, there's no way that system lasts another year without a replacement. I think NX gets formerly announced at E3 2016 and then comes out that November.

So, what Bethesda is saying...Reggie doesn't do anything to seduce third parties?

I can see that. And I imagine it isn't all about money hats. Simply talking to third parties could be beneficial. As fr as NOA is concerned it is simply marketing things that come from Japan. These aren't the Peter Main, Howard Lincoln and Arakawa days. Those guys were the next closest things to entrepreneurs. They were building something new.

It seems as though the way Nintendo operates is: You show interest in us, if not we will show no interest in you.

The Wii U had a much stronger lineup then the 3DS at this E3.  Not really sure where people keep getting the idea the 3DS is being supported more when most of it's games shown were either low budget sequels running off existing engines or already released Japanese games that are just being localized later.  Combined with the fact last years E3 wasn't that impressive for the 3DS either, the signs point much stronger to them gearing up more for the NX being a new handheld next year then home console.

Once again, with mobile devices eating away at the traditional handheld market all around the world and especially in Japan, there's no way Nintendo is going to focus on a new home console that could eat away resources they'll need to make sure the next handheld is a success.  This is like how back during the Wii era people were so sure the successor would be released in 2011, even though most of their major home console devs releasing games in 2009 and 2010 showed it'd be impossible to do that.  The same things is happening right now where most of Nintendo's home console teams have been releasing Wii U games in 2014 and 2015. 

The only way the NX can be a home console is if it's like the Wii where it's just a Wii U with more RAM put in it to allow for easier development since the teams can just reuse their Wii U engines with some minor upgrades and we all know how happy that will make some of you. ::)  Anyone expecting the NX to be a home console that can rival the PS4/One in power and still be released in Fall 2016 is just setting themselves up for disappointment.

this all rings true to my expectations. Anyone thinking Nintendo will have a new console out by 2016 are not being pessimistic in the right way. They probably wont have a new console out till 2017, there will probably be a total game drought in 2016 to mid 2017. The next console will probably only be marginally more powerful than a ps4.

the only optimism i can throw in, is they might have their shit together with their own game production and third party support by 2017. maybe.

Not at all the point I was making, but sure

While not definitive proof:

"We’ve also said publicly that we are already hard at work on our next home console and that’s another element we’ll be talking about much later."

This is one of those instances where it's to my benefit that I haven't played any of the Metroid Prime games.  Means I have time to pick up the trilogy and give it a Run on Wii U before they end up announcing  a new one.

I feed back for the Metroid fans who have been chomping at the bit for a new one though.  I feel the same way as someone whose begging to blow $60 on a new F-Zero game.

Well, let me put it this way: The Wii U only had 2 new games revealed in the Direct (Star Fox was announced last year), and both of them are shovelware. Everything else the Wii U has this year are titles that were greenlit years ago and delayed till this Fall because Nintendo can't get an HD game out the door to save their lives. Even Zelda is a title that we've known about for years. Nintendo announce ZERO major new projects for Wii U in that last Direct. By contrast, 3DS is at least still getting worthwhile new titles announced for next years, even if they are lower budget.

Would you like to make a friendly wager?

The NX, which as Adrock has pointed out has been more or less "outed" as a console, should be out in 2016 but probably won't be out until 2017.  It should in the sense that the plan to replace the Wii U should have started pretty damn early and I figure Nintendo took a while to admit the problem.  They're slow so I expect 2017 and, yes, I expect jack shit for the Wii U in that time and then Nintendo will wonder why no one gives a shit about their new console when they've disappeared for two years.

Perm suggested that consoles are peaking.  That's what we all hoped this time, that the need for the PS4 and XB1 wasn't there and those consoles would flop.  Well that didn't.  It all seemed at the time like we could make due with that level of graphics but things changed and we saw we could do better.  If Nintendo is relying on graphics to peak that's a big risk.

No Metroid and likely no Zelda.  Anyone else see the Saturn parallel when Sega didn't even get a real Sonic game out for it?

Well, the Xbox One, in spite of all the advantages it has, is barely outpacing the Wii U.
I wouldn't call the PS4 a flop by any means, but it sure ain't burning up any records.

"Peaking" might be a pretty good way to describe it.

The PS4's sold over 21 million units in less than 2 years. I'm pretty sure that's "burning up some records." Both consoles are outpacing their predecessors. I have my concerns about these consoles going forward since both have definitely had issues getting software out the door, but let's not pretend that there hasn't been an impressive showing thus far. Hell, if Nintendo hadn't cheaped-out with the Wii U, maybe their latest console wouldn't be 2nd only to the Virtual Boy as the biggest failure in the company's history.

Someone with better memory or faster reasearch skills can correct me (or give a more exact number), but didn't the top selling system from the last generation sell something like 40 million units in two years?  How is selling half-that burning up any kind of records?

Something something casuals something.

You know better by now, UncleBewb.

The Wii U was made obsolete a year after it came out by those other consoles.  It's best chance was that the market would reject the other new consoles, so the status quo would remain PS3, X360, Wii U which gave the Wii U a fighting chance.  Didn't happen.  So the NX has to not just compare well to the PS4 and XB1 but it also has to compare well to any hypothetical successors that would come out prior to the NX successor.  If Nintendo is going to be trapped in between generations like this they have to try to future proof their console.  So they can't assume that the market is going to be content with what we have now forever.  Maybe this generation can go long enough that Nintendo can "join" part way in and then go to the next gen with everyone else and still get a good length life out of the NX.  But they can't assume that or they'll just get lapped by the competition again or they'll have to kill the NX off prematurely which they really can't do.

Bringing up the Wii's success in 2015 is about as useful as bringing up the NES's success.  Doesn't help Nintendo's bottom line, doesn't sell the current product, has no meaningful impact on Nintendo's future.

I like video games.

And yet, the superior XBox One is barely outpacing the Wii U.. what does that say?

I did not bring up the Wii's success.  I brought up historical sales figures for comparison to the claim that the PS4's 20-some million units in two years is some kind of evidence that the home console market is alive and well - which is weird when it's half of what the market leader did just one generation ago.

Software sales are also not looking good, despite healthy PS4 sales. We're past the point where it can just be blamed on "well of course sales look bad compared to when GTAV was released". There's also a really anemic release schedule all around with a really homogenized design baseline. Things ain't looking too healthy to me. I'll admit to a smidgen of schadenfreude here, but in actuality it's really not good for Nintendo's prospects when the whole traditional sector seems to be contracting. 

That Microsoft's initial anti-consumer plans pissed people off and that forcing a Kinect purchase didn't fly.  Plus MS has ZERO presence in Japan which skewers the figures if you look at it from a worldwide perspective.  How is the Xbox One doing in America and Europe compared to the Wii U?

Though I still don't see the relevance.  So consoles aren't doing as well in general this gen as they were last gen.  So what?  How does that help Nintendo next gen?

It could help Nintendo next gen because if customer didn't buy a console they might want to buy a new one. The price most people are willing to buy a console for is $250. Wii sold at that price and sold well. Wii U was $350 and is now $299. Ps4 is the best selling console at $399. Its only $100 more expensive than Wii U. If Wii u were to get competitive with its price than it might start selling. 3rd party support will not come back though.

What Nintendo should do is release a version of the console without the wii u gamepad for $150 cheaper. and then do something like this.

http://www.vsszone.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/Phonejoy1.jpg

I can't help but think we're having two different conversations.

Console sales have peaked.  There's little demand for them world-wide.  Wii U sales are in the tank.  XBoxOne sales aren't much better (regardless of how you crutch them).  PS4 sales aren't bad, but they're nothing to get excited over.  All three systems combined probably don't even meet the sales of the market leader by this time last gen (MS and Nintendo are about 10 Million units each while Sony is around 20 - meanwhile, Wii sold like 40 million plus units in two years).

The console market *is* dying.  At the very least, it's in hibernation.  Did it peak last-generation and we'll never see sales like that again?  I dunno.

I think it's a little unfair to compare the Wii to the PS4. Beyond the fact that one launched at $250 while the other launched at $400, they set out do different things, and the Wii appealed to people who wouldn't traditionally call themselves gamers. Maybe if another wide-appeal console with a "revolutionary" (for lack of a better word) hook hit the market, we would see Wii-level sales again. None of the current gen consoles can claim to be that, so it's hard to say whether the numbers inferior to the Wii are due to a dying market or just because none of the current gen consoles have the perfect set of attributes for wide appeal that the Wii did.


Last I heard, the PS4 and the Xbox One were selling at a greater pace than their own last gen counterparts, which is a more apt comparison imo. Maybe console gaming is dying in some places, or in some form, but I think a blanket statement like "console gaming is dying" is oversimplifying things a bit.

I still have friends who are wanting to buy a Wii Mini despite implicit instructions on how its a waste of money. They're also the type who still want a ps3. I can get behind getting the ps3 more than a wii mini, but for not that much more you can buy a ps4. To me a big purchase is a big purchase.

I don't think consoles are dying, it's just that a large segment of the audience that made them big last gen have moved to phones.  Most of those people weren't around during the PS2/GC/XB gen so how is this gen comparing to that one?

I'm pretty sure with the right attraction anybody would buy a console. The appeal of having a new cell phone or tablet may take away sales temporarily, but I don't see that as a long term thing. Nintendo tends to do well in handhelds, but i can see THAT actually being the market that gets destroyed. If Nintendo put as much attention towards their consoles as they currently do their handheld than it would be doing better. I think Nintendo remains successful on the hnadheld front because they focus on that because they are worried about losing that revenue source.

Interesting how they specifically said "Metroid Prime" and not just "Metroid." I still feel three games is enough in the Prime style (or four if Hunters counts, never played it), so I hope if there is a Prime 4 then it has significant differences.

While I like the first person metroid, im not opposed to a 3rd person metroid. I just dont want 2 button metroid.