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3DSWiiU

Nintendo Cuts Wii U Sales Forecast

by Andrew Brown and Scott Thompson - January 17, 2014, 7:02 am PST
Total comments: 85 Source: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2014/140117e.pdf, Nintendo Readjusted Forecasts

Both the Wii U and 3DS are now projected to sell fewer units than initially predicted.

Nintendo has adjusted its 2013 fiscal year predictions, cutting the forecast for Wii U sales from the original figure of 9 million units worldwide to a meager 2.8 million.

On the software side, Nintendo has cut its prediction in half from 38 million units sold to 19 million.

During the holiday sales period, known for being the most profitable time of the year for companies in the game industry, software sales were significantly lower than the predicted numbers. Nintendo attributes this fact to lower-than-expected Wii U sales.

In the first two quarters of this fiscal year, the Wii U sold only 460,000 units worldwide, a mere 6% of its projected sales. Even with a strong December--Wii U is rumored to have sold somewhere between 450,000 to 500,000 units last month--reaching the initial projection was going to be nearly impossible.

Despite being the best-selling console of 2013 in the US, sales predictions for the 3DS have been readjusted as well. Nintendo has dropped the expected 18 million units sold to 13.5 million, while also moving software sold to 60 million from 80 million.

Talkback

EvilMarioJanuary 17, 2014


Some new quotes from CVG / Bloomberg from the press conference this morning as well.

Quote:

"We cannot continue a business without winning," Iwata said on Friday during a press conference attended by Bloomberg. "We must take a sceptical approach whether we can still simply make game players, offer them in the same way as in the past for 20,000 yen or 30,000 yen, and sell titles for a couple of thousand yen each.


"We are thinking about a new business structure," Iwata added. "Given the expansion of smart devices, we are naturally studying how smart devices can be used to grow the game-player business. It's not as simple as enabling Mario to move on a smartphone."

2014 is going to be an interesting year for Nintendo. I'm still of mind their next system will be portable, with the option to output to the television (through HDMI, streaming, or whatever means they come up with). Consolidating the two pieces of hardware into one makes allot of sense, from cutting down on R&D cost, not splitting the userbase that may only purchase one, or the other, and all your development resources being focused on the one device.


What's really interesting though is Iwata's future. If he's replaced, then by whom? If it's from inside the company, change probably comes more slowly. If it's from outside the company, someone with more mobile ambition, perhaps we see things shift more quickly. eShop / VC releases on Android and their own dedicated system, with the few so called 'premium' games being exclusive to their own hardware. I could see something like that.


I'm sure there'll be a Nintendo Direct coming soon, but I wouldn't count on it for long term answers. Never a dull moment in this industry..

broodwarsJanuary 17, 2014

;D

(more fully-formed rant to come in the near-future, but suffice it to say 2014 should be a fun year to watch now that Iwata's back is against the wall and Wii U is officially a failure)

BlackNMild2k1January 17, 2014

FIRE-SALE!!!!!    EVERYTHING MUST GO! GO! GO!!!!!

Hopefully Nintendo comes all the way out their bubble and addresses a lot of the criticisms toward their current hardware, software and company policies.

Ian SaneJanuary 17, 2014

My prediction of the Wii U being discontinued in 2014 might actually come true.  It sounds weird to hear Iwata say "We must take a sceptical approach whether we can still simply make game players".  Dang it, I don't want them to make shitty mobile games.  I just want them to make a console that I actually want to own!  Even Nintendo as a handheld-only company is something I could make do with so saying "game players" seems like an over-reaction.  Plus there is a sense of "oh, it's impossible" that conveniently deflects blame from Nintendo.  The problem is entirely in the product Nintendo chose to release.  No, there is no market for last gen hardware with no third party support that gets cookie cutter first party sequels released at a snail's pace where the only distinguishing feature is a gimmick controller that doesn't even get used that much.

It's like Nintendo focused on all the crappy parts of the Wii that the Wii succeeded despite of and ignored the qualities that made it popular in the first place.  The Wii sold entirely because the motion control concept was something people had dreamed about for years.  That's a very specific feature and it shows how clueless Nintendo is when they come to the conclusion that outdated hardware w/ gimmick controller = PROFIT!!  Waggle in NSMB didn't make the Wii successful.  It was the game where you swing your controller and the character on the screen swings his racket the same way that created the whole frenzy.  It was this one feature that grabbed people's imaginations so effectively that they were willing to overlook the numerous flaws.  I swear if Iwata was in charge of Nintendo in the past he would have associated Pokémon's success with the non-color Game Boy screen and made the future games in black & white.

I'm surprised they had to re-adjust their 3DS projections since all I've heard since the price cut is how successful the system is and it is a damn good product with great games.  Is it big in North America but not in Japan?

CericJanuary 17, 2014

This took a very long time to get posted.

Anyway, should be a good jolt to Nintendo.  We'll see what they do with it but, Wii U days are probably now officially numbered.

Ian SaneJanuary 17, 2014

Oh shit, I just realized that if the Wii U gets discontinued then X might not get translated for the Western market! Arrrrgh!!!!  I mean if your console is a bust why would you bother localizing a niche game that would probably end up one of the last games released for the system?

broodwarsJanuary 17, 2014

Quote from: Ian

Oh ****, I just realized that if the Wii U gets discontinued then X might not get translated for the Western market! Arrrrgh!!!!  I mean if your console is a bust why would you bother localizing a niche game that would probably end up one of the last games released for the system?

If the Wii U is discontinued, X will either just get released for the Wii U anyway or get retooled for the 3DS (aka "the only system Nintendo actually cares about anymore"). Nintendo's spent way too much time and money on X at this point to simply cancel it.

Ian SaneJanuary 17, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: Ian

Oh ****, I just realized that if the Wii U gets discontinued then X might not get translated for the Western market! Arrrrgh!!!!  I mean if your console is a bust why would you bother localizing a niche game that would probably end up one of the last games released for the system?

If the Wii U is discontinued, X will either just get released for the Wii U anyway or get retooled for the 3DS (aka "the only system Nintendo actually cares about anymore"). Nintendo's spent way too much time and money on X at this point to simply cancel it.

I'm not talking about canceling it, just not localizing it for North America.

broodwarsJanuary 17, 2014

Quote from: Ian

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: Ian

Oh ****, I just realized that if the Wii U gets discontinued then X might not get translated for the Western market! Arrrrgh!!!!  I mean if your console is a bust why would you bother localizing a niche game that would probably end up one of the last games released for the system?

If the Wii U is discontinued, X will either just get released for the Wii U anyway or get retooled for the 3DS (aka "the only system Nintendo actually cares about anymore"). Nintendo's spent way too much time and money on X at this point to simply cancel it.

I'm not talking about canceling it, just not localizing it for North America.

Eh, I don't see X's localization chances being that much worse if the Wii U were discontinued. At the very least, Nintendo of Europe would do their job and localize it, and now that Reggie's not calling the shots at NoA I don't see X not getting brought over here eventually.

BlackNMild2k1January 17, 2014

If Wii U gets "discontinued" then it wouldn't happen until they were ready to announce something to replace it (crosses fingers for "hybrid" idea ;)) and X may just get "up-ported" to that system instead.

and if that happens to be my "hybrid" idea (crosses fingers) then they really wouldn't have much work to do anyway.

Killer_Man_JaroTom Malina, Associate Editor (Europe)January 17, 2014

Those who genuinely believe that the Wii U will be discontinued in the next 3 years have a fundamental misunderstanding of how Nintendo is run as a company and a business. They will see it through to the end, for better or worse for their financials. The Wii U is going nowhere.

If we've learned anything from Nintendo's last three consoles, they will almost certainly stubbornly stick by the Wii U several years past the point where it is at all viable for any third party publishers.

BlackNMild2k1January 17, 2014

2015: Year of the "Hybrid"
successor to the 3DS (& "stop gap" for the Wii U)

I'm putting a flagged pin on the calendar.

Luigi DudeJanuary 17, 2014

It's not like Nintendo just suddenly woke up today and realized the Wii U is doing terrible.  There's a reason they waited until the end of November when Mario 3D World was released to actually start advertising the system again.  If the Wii U was in a position where it was in danger of being discontinued because of current sales, they would have released Donkey Kong during the holiday season like it was originally planed and found a way to rush Mario Kart 8 while announcing Smash Bros would be coming out in early 2014.

Ian SaneJanuary 17, 2014

They're talking about this on US Gamer and it says that Nintendo's forecast is going from a $527 million profit to a $240 million loss.  How long can Nintendo hold on with those kind of figures?  That isn't the 3DS keeping the Wii U afloat but rather the Wii U dragging the whole thing down.  There is a certain point where Nintendo could not afford to continue to make the Wii U.

How will third parties respond to this?  Yeah the support is bad but how bad could it get?  Could we get the point where we can easily count the amount of games that come out per year?  And then how does that affect retailers?  If very few games come out and the console isn't selling then stores don't want a dud eating up valuable floor space.  They don't want to commit to product that won't sell.  Nintendo doesn't have complete control of the fate of the Wii U.

Anyone know what Nintendo's projected vs. actual sales of the Gamecube was since that comes up all the time whenever anyone says that Nintendo will stick by the Wii U?  Did it ever get to the point where it was less than a THIRD of what they were projecting?

I'm pretty sure the N64 got to the point where you could easily count the releases.

Mop it upJanuary 17, 2014

I'm not so sure that Nintendo should listen to what shareholders want. They're all about the short-term profit, whereas Nintendo have to think about how to sustain their business for the long run. Shareholders wouldn't care if Nintendo went out of business tomorrow if they made money today. I'm not really sure what that smart devices comment could mean, as the handheld space isn't where Nintendo is having a problem. The 3DS is doing really well, and so are its games sales. If they think it's under-performing simply because it hasn't sold as well as the DS, it's too high a bar to shoot for the best-selling system in all history. I hope they don't do anything stupid to mess up the good thing they got going with the 3DS because they tried to make it sell like the DS.

As for the Wii U, I'm reminded of a quote I saw in another forum thread about the GameCube: “We are a very small game company. We do not have the resources of these others.” Nintendo can't compete with the tech giants of MS and Sony, they may have created a war chest from the huge profits of the Wii and DS, but they still can't afford to create a beefy system and sell it at a premium price for such extreme losses. Further, I don't see a point in doing that either. Why have three systems on the market that are all essentially the same thing? Heck, we had four during Gen VI (DC, PS2, Xbox, GCN), and it felt completely pointless to me. Nintendo should continue to create their own brand of system like they have with the Wii, Wii U, DS, and 3DS, they just need to find the right thing. For this gen though, their best bet for the long term is to just continue trying to make the Wii U a success. Any other drastic choice is too risky for their small company.

MiyamotoJanuary 17, 2014

Nintendo has been lazy and greedy for some time now. This was to be expected. Huge changes needed to pull out of this nose-dive. I love Nintendo more than anyone here but I've got no sympathy for them after watching them court disaster for about four years now.



MagicCow64January 17, 2014

Smartphone comments are somewhat worrying, but could be meant to placate restive shareholders who have been barking for years about putting Nintendo software on mobile platforms.

I agree with the above sentiments that Nintendo is not about to pull the plug on the WiiU. Hybrid or regular console follow-up, there's no way they'll have a platform ready to take its place until 2016 without grievously rushing it. I guess they could start up-converting most of the WiiU software they currently have in development, but given how slow they are at HD development this would probably just put them deeper in the hole and in the meantime leave them as a complete non-entity in the console space for at least a year.

Kytim89January 17, 2014

Nintendo is getting a double-handed slap of reality. Although I do not see them dumping the Wii U right away, Nintendo will simply try and keep the system as profitable as possible until an alternative is revealed. However, with the way the system is selling Nintendo has defenently accelerated their plans for whatever replaces the Wii U. Honestly, even if Nintendo makes some profit off of the Wii U then Smash Brothers and Mario Kart might be the only big titles that Nintendo makes for the system. They might move development for Zelda Wii U to whatever replaces the console.

BlackNMild2k1January 17, 2014

By smart device I'm thinking he's referring to all teh smart TV's and companion boxes out there. They are being pushed as the next big thing at CES even though we've had them for a few years now.

If that is the case, then Nintendo could have been ahead of the curve if they just opened up their eShop to more apps. We have Netflix, Hulu+, Amazon & Youtube, but we don't have Pandora, Vudu, Facebook, Twitter, etc etc.
These things add lots of daily and minute to minute free value that would get alot of people to just pick up the controller turn the thing on ever day. Games are a problem they can't seem to solve quick enough (where are all the VC games Nintendo!!?), but apps is where they can start to make some headway.
Open it up for a Disney Channel App and a XfinityTV app and Crackle App and a TV Guide app or whatever other apps you can find out there that people will turn the system on for while not playing games.

I don't really see what Nintendo is doing to reverse their fortunes over the last 6-8 months, but from the outside looking in, it looks like they are sitting on their hands staring out the window and waiting for the rain to stop because they don't want to go outside and get their hands dirty.
And even though good things come to those that wait, I'm not sure how long they expect us to wait for them (MK8, SSBU, Zelda, X, and whatever else they have planned couldn't come soon enough).

Kytim89January 17, 2014

Curious to know if the Wii U's fortune would improve if Nintendo re-branded the console by changing the name from Wii U to something else, but keeping the console the same?

I don't see how that would be at all feasible. I'm not sure if it's possible at this point, but I think that might make things even more confusing for consumers.

Kytim89January 17, 2014

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

I don't see how that would be at all feasible. I'm not sure if it's possible at this point, but I think that might make things even more confusing for consumers.

They are already confused by the "Wii" in the console's name. If it was re-named to something more catchy that differentiated it from the Wii then sales might pick up.

StratosJanuary 17, 2014

I would be quite disheartened if they discontinued the system. Though the bright spot is that there are/will be enough titles by the end of 2014 to justify the purchase for me, especially of all the games drop to bargain bin prices.


Be interesting if the Wii U becomes the next Dreamcast from a collector's stand point.

Quote from: Kytim89

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

I don't see how that would be at all feasible. I'm not sure if it's possible at this point, but I think that might make things even more confusing for consumers.

They are already confused by the "Wii" in the console's name. If it was re-named to something more catchy that differentiated it from the Wii then sales might pick up.

They would be more confused by the name change than they are now. I get that people don't like the name and agree that it wasn't a great choice, but it's too late to change it now. They need to focus on fixing their marketing for the system to eliminate the confusion while keeping the current name.

Kytim89January 17, 2014

Ten years from now people will look upon the Wii as being a modern SNES. All of its games will be considred collector's items. As for the Wii U, if it has about a year or two more of life on the market then it will be looked back upon as a modern equivalent to the Saturn. Not in terms of sales, but the amount of quality titles that while not a whole lot of them exist, they are worth having in someone's collection.

BlackNMild2k1January 17, 2014

It might help if they relaunched with a new name like it was a new system, but it would have helped more if they just didn't name it Wii U in the beginning like I'm sure so many of us knew was a mistake.
I know some people called that people would mistake the tablet as an add-on for the Wii way back at E3 2011 when it was announced, actually, people were mistaking it for just that back then too.

But a name change at this point may be waaaaay tooooo little waaaaay tooooo late.
At this point though, it might not even matter.

Ian SaneJanuary 17, 2014

The editorial the NWR put up hypothesizes that the 3DS projection getting lowered may be due to the 2DS not selling.  What would be the main problem with the 2DS?  It's name suggests that it's a different product when it isn't.  It's a 3DS but using a completely different name always ran the risk of market confusion.

So if they change the Wii U name you're going to have existing Wii U owners wondering what this new product, let's call it the N6, is and whether they need to buy it.  Will N6 owners know that old Wii U games will run on their console?  Will Wii U owners realize that these new games with "N6" on the cover run on their Wii U?  I think it would create the misconception that the newly branded Wii U is actually a new console, which means that all the cons of replacing the Wii U at this point are present but none of the pros.  Everyone thinks they abandoned the Wii U early when they didn't while those that know better will know that it's still just the same Wii U that they didn't want to buy.  A different font/logo and chassis redesign for the console itself might help establish the clear separation between Wii and Wii U but that's the most I would do.

What scares me about the smart device comment is that if Nintendo went to smartphones would it be something they actually thought out or just a panic move?  Do they actually realize why the Wii U is flopping or are they clueless and "smart devices" is just them giving in to stockholders because they have no clue what they did wrong in the first place and are just going to wildly shoot in the dark and hope they hit something?  I fear that if Nintendo went smart phone as a kneejerk reaction, it would just sink them further.  They need a real plan, for whatever they do next, and that requires a certain awareness of the situation.  "Fuck, I don't know why the Wii U is bombing.  Let's just try this." is the second worst approach they could take.  The worst would be to ignore the situation and do nothing.

Though naturally I don't want them to make smartphone games because phones are shitty devices for games and the output would just be shitty games.  Nintendo surviving with shitty games is no different to me than them dying off.  Actually it's worse because their IP couldn't even be sold to someone who could do something good with them.

If Nintendo was to develop for hardware that isn't their own the best case scenario from a gamer perspective would be them making third party console games while giving exclusive support in the handheld market to their own handheld.  At least then we'd still get good stuff.

If they go smartphone they'll lose their whole edge with the 3DS.  How buttfucking dumb would they have to be to kill the one thing they have going for them?  If they do that then they really are dumb assholes that fluked their way to success on the Wii.

Kytim89January 17, 2014

Most of the people that have bought Wii Us are Nintendo loyalists, so it stands to reason that if you rebrand the consoles name only then those layol fans will see that there is no difference and continue supporting the console. The issue is that the vast majoirty of potential buyers are confused by the name. I do not care what anyone says, sales will not pick up until Nintendo dumps the console, or changes its name.

If the Wii U had been named "Super Wii", "Nintendo Stream", or "Nintendo Phantom" then would sales have been as sluggish this past year? As for the 2DS, had Nintendo called it "3DS Lite" then it might have sold better. For example, when the Vita came out every that I know called it "PSP Vita" when in reality it was anew brand of handheld from Sony.

OblivionJanuary 17, 2014

Kytim. :confused;

ShyGuyJanuary 17, 2014

I guess if Nintendo closes its doors, I still have Steam for Linux Nintendo isn't closing its doors

AdrockJanuary 17, 2014

I can't believe the name change suggestion is still a thing. Nintendo had roughly a year and a half to change the name. Once the console launched, they can't change it anymore. What might help is if Nintendo launches a redesigned console.

Kytim89January 17, 2014

At this point Nintendo has three options with the Wii U. First, they can rename it and hope it sells more units. Second, they could continue as usual and hope to keep the Wii U some  what profitable. Third, they could just declare the Wii U a bust, take it off the market and return to the home console space two years from now with a better game plan. Which of these is likely happen? I want to say the first, but it will most likely be the second option.

Kytim89January 17, 2014

Quote from: Adrock

I can't believe the name change suggestion is still a thing. Nintendo had roughly a year and a half to change the name. Once the console launched, they can't change it anymore. What might help is if Nintendo launches a redesigned console.

Adrock, the name Wii U has been what is dragging this console down from the get go. Even if Nintendo went to every house in the world advertising the Wii U then no one would understand the name difference. All of the marketing and games in the world will not help. A change in name might give it a sales boost.

BlackNMild2k1January 17, 2014

Even if a name change were to happen, it would need to happen with a console redesign.

New name comes with a new look.
probably should launch with new colors too.

Kytim89January 17, 2014

If Nintendo had not named the console "Wii U" then it would probably be setting at ten million units. It might still have had the software issue, but that can be alleviated. If the console sales pick up so will its software support. 

BlackNMild2k1January 17, 2014

That ship has already sailed my friend. The only way to fix that is with a time machine, and if I had one of those, I wouldn't be wasting it on that. ;)

AdrockJanuary 18, 2014

Quote from: Kytim89

If Nintendo had not named the console "Wii U" then it would probably be setting at ten million units. It might still have had the software issue, but that can be alleviated. If the console sales pick up so will its software support. 

No, it wouldn't. And the lack of compelling software can be fixed without a name change. I'm baffled that we're even still talking about this. All changing the name after a console launches does is confuse people even more. Nintendo would need to recall and rebrand every single unsold accessory and game. All "Wii U" references in Miiverse the shop would have to be replaced. That sounds like a nightmare.

If Nintendo were to release a redesign, it may be beneficial to also offer some additional benefit that doesn't affect existing users ability to play games like a hard drive or DVD/Blu Ray playback. Neither are necessary (though a case can be made for the former more than the latter), but they could help set the new design apart.

BigJimJanuary 18, 2014

People aren't buying evergreen titles like Poke a Fake Dog with a Stick anymore? Bummer. :) Nintendo needed a time like this. They need something to wake them up. It's the market's version of tough love. Heck knows what they were doing for the 2 years the Wii was basically abandoned. (Called that and the game droughts 7-8 years ago, but the young fans here wouldn't hear a word of it.)

Nintendo doesn't have much of a choice when it comes to Wii U. They're gonna soldier through and finish a 5 year cycle, but the next console needs to grow up and Nintendo needs to pop their 20-year-old bubble. Aging IPs, sequelitis, and gimmicks are not the treasure trove they used to be.

OblivionJanuary 18, 2014

Quote from: Kytim89

If Nintendo had not named the console "Wii U" then it would probably be setting at ten million units.

Should I post my facepalm GIF again? I'm not quite sure if it's worth something as stupid as this sentence.

Kytim89January 18, 2014

Quote from: Oblivion

Quote from: Kytim89

If Nintendo had not named the console "Wii U" then it would probably be setting at ten million units.

Should I post my facepalm GIF again? I'm not quite sure if it's worth something as stupid as this sentence.

Is your sarcasm detector broken? I hate the Wii U name.

smallsharkbigbiteJanuary 18, 2014

The 2DS really messed with consumers.  I was at a Toys R Us around the holidays, a couple had the original DS.  They were asking a clerk about one of the 3DS games because it said playable in 2D on the 2DS on the label.  So they thought DS = 2DS and they could play it.  And the clerk didn't know any better.


The Wii U name was a mistake, but I don't think it can be fixed now without a new system.  I think while Adrock is technically correct (Wii U needs games and that is fixable), I don't have faith in Nintendo to keep the release schedule filled and products that bomb rarely catch on even if they fix the reason why they bombed because public perception is difficult to change. 

BlackNMild2k1January 18, 2014

They should have called the 2DS the 3Dless, that would've helped the common consumer not be confused.

BlackNMild2k1January 18, 2014

They also should have called the Wii U the Nu Wii, that way everyone would know exactly what they were looking for.... the New Wii.

StratosJanuary 18, 2014

Wii Deuce, Wii Nu... Wii Cycle.

OblivionJanuary 18, 2014

Quote from: Kytim89

Quote from: Oblivion

Quote from: Kytim89

If Nintendo had not named the console "Wii U" then it would probably be setting at ten million units.

Should I post my facepalm GIF again? I'm not quite sure if it's worth something as stupid as this sentence.

Is your sarcasm detector broken? I hate the Wii U name.

Exactly. Get the fuck over it.

Who the hell is Nintendo paying to produce their forecasts?  I can't fathom why their projected sales numbers were so inflated.  They may not have known the Wii U would have failed so spectacularly this fiscal year, but nothing they've done this year has given any reason to believe they'd sell this high a number of consoles.


I can't begin to fathom how they dig themselves out of this hole with Wii U.  Certainly they can learn a lot of what the consumer base is clamoring for by simply looking at their competition.  I don't know whether this is a sign that Nintendo has finally had a cold bucket of water poured on their heads, or a sign that Iwata knows he's in serious danger of being ousted, and him admitting he may not be suitable to lead the company moving forward.


Not that I come from any point of authority on this subject, but a few of my thoughts:



Anyone thinking the name of the console is a primary problem for they system's sales is wrong.  It coupled with zero marketing could be argued for a case, but the name of the system isn't that big an issue, if the name "Xbox One" is any indication.
I'm not sure if they'll give up on the console outright, but anyone think they might abandon-ship on the Wii U gamepad? Separate it from the console itself, sell the console as a budget console ($250) with the pro controller, and offer the gamepad as a separate accessory?  That way they could follow-suit with Sony/Microsoft by having a dedicated tablet app for off-tv play & maybe still carve out a decent niche profit to tide them over until next release.
I think it's pretty clear the 3rd party ship has sailed.  I don't see Nintendo courting them back this generation, but maybe if they go the Sony route they can actively attract and cultivate the indie developers.






AdrockJanuary 19, 2014

Making the GamePad optional would require Nintendo to rewrite pretty much all code in the system software including the eshop and Miiverse. Additionally, several games wouldn't even work without it and making a once included controller optional complicates things. Wii U IS the GamePad. It's too ingrained in the console's DNA to be sold separately as an optional purchase. Nintendo could make the GamePad optional in a successor. However, I think it's more likely that Nintendo improves upon it and continues making it slimmer and lighter. And no, kytim, they wouldn't make it Vita-sized.

Kytim89January 19, 2014

Quote from: Adrock

Making the GamePad optional would require Nintendo to rewrite pretty much all code in the system software including the eshop and Miiverse. Additionally, several games wouldn't even work without it and making a once included controller optional complicates things. Wii U IS the GamePad. It's too ingrained in the console's DNA to be sold separately as an optional purchase. Nintendo could make the GamePad optional in a successor. However, I think it's more likely that Nintendo improves upon it and continues making it slimmer and lighter. And no, kytim, they wouldn't make it Vita-sized.

Adrock, the idea of the Vita sized Gamepad was for the Wii U successor. Later in the decade wi-fi will have improved enough to allow Nintendo to make a smaller  Gamepad about the size of a Vita that can play games anywhere via cloud streaming. 

OblivionJanuary 19, 2014

WiFi is fine where it is. It's the ISPs that need to get their act together. Don't confuse one for the other.

StratosJanuary 19, 2014

Speaking of ISPs, the day after I read about the courts throwing out the rules on net neutrality I notice that certain parts of the internet are running slower that never have before.

OblivionJanuary 19, 2014

You sure that isn't a coincidence?

AdrockJanuary 19, 2014

Quote from: Kytim89

Adrock, the idea of the Vita sized Gamepad was for the Wii U successor. Later in the decade wi-fi will have improved enough to allow Nintendo to make a smaller  Gamepad about the size of a Vita that can play games anywhere via cloud streaming. 

The previous time you brought that up was most certainly the first time. You've been pushing that thought for a while now. I'm still not quite sure why you would want the screen to be smaller. To carrying around more easily? No thanks. I don't want a worse home experience for a better on-the-go experience.

AdrockJanuary 19, 2014

*not the first time

BlackNMild2k1January 19, 2014

The name, no marketing, very similar console design and complete focus on the GamePad is what led to lackluster initial sales, because a lot of the general public was confused as to what Nintendo was selling.

Add-on for the Wii? New system? Who knows, Nintendo wasn't working very hard to make it absolutely clear.

And no, there will not be a rebranding minus the game pad, that is far to much work for Nintendo.

OblivionJanuary 19, 2014

I fail to see how concentrating on the GamePad is a bad thing.

AdrockJanuary 19, 2014

In terms of unveiling the console, focusing on the GamePad made it unclear that Nintendo was launching a successor rather than an accessory for the original Wii. Nintendo picked every worst choice in that respect. The only way they could have been more confusing would be if they didn't change the name or design at all.

smallsharkbigbiteJanuary 19, 2014

Quote from: BlackNMild2k1

The name, no marketing, very similar console design and complete focus on the GamePad is what led to lackluster initial sales, because a lot of the general public was confused as to what Nintendo was selling.

While I don't disagree that those were mistakes, I think it comes back to games and Nintendo doesn't have the games the market wants.  Wii Sports sold the Wii because it was reasonably priced and motion controls were the "new" (innovative) thing when they came out.  Now they aren't and the best selling console (PS4) put motion controls in the back seat. 


Nintendo thought the gamepad was innovative and it isn't.  I know it's not a tablet, but it's hard not to compare the two since most people have both (or at least a tablet).  Tablets have much higher res screens, multi-touch, much better OS systems, and much cheaper (and more extensive) software.  That's not to say the gamepad is bad (I like it mostly), but people aren't going to buy a Wii U for the gamepad.  They are going to buy a Wii U for games and many people find it lacking in that regard. 

BlackNMild2k1January 19, 2014

Yeah, but people also weren't going to buy the gamepad for the Wii, which was kinda a problem since that's what they thought it was for. The games may have generated an interest, but they still would have been confused when they got to the store only to realize it wasn't for the Wii and it wasn't a tablet or handheld.
This was a total failure in marketing, design and follow through.

Ian SaneJanuary 20, 2014

The name is bad but the console has squat for third party support and Nintendo themselves were caught off guard by HD development (which is probably the most idiotic thing about the Wii U; how do you not notice what literally every other company in your industry was going through years ago?) and release games at a snail's pace.  Give it whatever name you want, that still makes for a very unappealing product.

The Wii U isn't some great console with a bad name and bungled marketing campaign.  It is a weak product and its low sales are completely justified.  The name was just one of many things Nintendo screwed up but it is nuts to think that if they just had a better name it would all be different.

BlackNMild2k1January 20, 2014

What's even more ironic is that Iwata discussed the up him battle with HD development before the gen started and said how they have been studying it and were ready. But did they flunk that test. Guess they grabbed the wrong book for that study session.

Ian SaneJanuary 20, 2014

Quote from: BlackNMild2k1

What's even more ironic is that Iwata discussed the up him battle with HD development before the gen started and said how they have been studying it and were ready. But did they flunk that test. Guess they grabbed the wrong book for that study session.

In retrospect I'm assuming that this was just the canned excuse Nintendo came up with to placate their fans and that they themselves never believed it.  Either that or they figured because it wouldn't affect THEM and that all those other companies are just idiots that aren't as S-M-R-T as Nintendo!

Here's something to think about: what impact is this piece of news going to have on the Wii U's future?  Now I don't expect the average Joe to even know about this but any hardcore gamer knows and is probably thinking that the Wii U has no future and that they shouldn't buy one.  You don't want people to think your videogame system is a flop or they'll be cautious about buying it and then that will just snowball and the system really won't have a future.  And you know GameStop employees can be obnoxious fanboys so there will be potential customers being told that the Wii U is getting discontinued by salespeople somewhere.  Kids will be spreading this all over the schoolyard.

I've been in favour of Nintendo replacing the Wii U ASAP and I think part of the justification for that would be that the Wii U's status as a flop is just going to create negative word-of-mouth the longer Nintendo sticks with it.

BlackNMild2k1January 20, 2014

Thanks for excusing and reading past all the spelling errors in that post that were due to using a tablet with swype and not proof-reading three times over to make sure it wasn't auto correcting/changing my spelling/words.
That was almost illegible.

But I think a redesign of the console itself along with releasing it in Blue and Silver while jump starting a new campaign focusing on the console as being NEW and the emphasizing the use of the gamepad to do things away from and in unison with the TV might give the brand a shot in the arm.

Dropping the system outright and rebooting with something else is gonna get ignored, much like the Dreamcast, and that will be hard to recover from. The trust will have been lost and the buyers will have felt burned.

StratosJanuary 20, 2014

They could be releasing new models with more storage space and things like improved battery life. Gets new people looking again and could get people to upgrade. Like with the DSi or the XL.

BlackNMild2k1January 20, 2014

That is certainly something they should consider.

extended battery in all the gamepads, 64GB internal storage standard & $5 eShop credit with pack-in of Nintendoland (digital copy) & SM3DW (disc copy).

and make it not look like an external HDD or a Wii. and include a manufacturers coupon to save $10 off a 3rd party game on a specific list of supporting new popular 3rd party games.

Lets spend a little and gamble on consumer awareness turning things around.

StratosJanuary 20, 2014

Or we could do a true deluxe release with the Wii U XL and make the Gamepad capable of playing 3DS games.


We had the Super Gameboy on the SNES, play through the N64 Transfer Pak (with Pokemon Stadium) and also the Gameboy Player on the Gamecube. Give us a way to play DS/3DS games on the big screen and that adds more value to the system.

BlackNMild2k1January 20, 2014

That would certainly give them reason to start releasing all the 3DS games digitally so that they can be played on your Wii U.

so many ways for Nintendo to make money off their games yet they seem to sit there, staring out the window, day dreaming about the days when they were making record amounts of profit on accident with the Wii.... "How can we replicate it, if we're not sure what we did"

Ian SaneJanuary 20, 2014

Quote from: BlackNMild2k1

Dropping the system outright and rebooting with something else is gonna get ignored, much like the Dreamcast, and that will be hard to recover from. The trust will have been lost and the buyers will have felt burned.

One thing that Sega fucked up in regards to the Saturn/Dreamcast transition is that they just ended the Saturn and then had nothing going for them until the Dreamcast came out.  Bernie Stolar infamously said in an interview "the Saturn is not our future" which might as well be an advertising campaign stating "don't buy a Saturn!"  Perhaps Nintendo could be a little smarter and have a smoother transition with the Wii U continuing to get support until its successor is released.  It would be idiotic to just announce the Wii U being discontinued and then just be out of the console market until the successor is ready.  They should be smart enough to not say a damn thing until they really are ready to go and not reveal the successor until the same year it is due to come out.

As for turning off the existing buyers, um, what existing buyers?  I have a feeling most of the existing Wii U owners are such Nintendo nuts that Miyamoto could shit in a box and they would buy it.  Who here owns a Wii U and would be so offended by it being discontinued that they would not buy Nintendo's next console?  And Nintendo did do this before with the Virtual Boy.  They decided that killing the thing and pretending it never existed was the best course of action and it didn't seem to have any negative impact on consumer trust.

Is Nintendo sticking to some unwanted console for five years with virtually no third party support going to create all sorts of consumer goodwill?  Is five years of borderline irrelevancy in the console market going to help Nintendo's next console?  I think the Wii U was partially hurt by Nintendo's slim support of the Wii for the last few years of its life so continuing that trend doesn't seem like a good idea.

The hell with marketing and name changes, how about Nintendo do something to get some fucking games released and actually make the Wii U a decent product?  If they're so dumbstruck by HD development why aren't they increasing the size of their teams or acquiring devs or at least courting them for a second party arrangement?  Instead of trying to fool people with marketing into thinking the Wii U is improved how about they try to actually improve it?  Try some unfamiliar genres, create new IP, work with some Western devs to make something that isn't so Japan-focused, actually use the damn Gamepad in an interesting way if you're going to force everyone to buy it.  All the fancy marketing isn't going to sell the Wii U with more 2D sidescrollers that would have come across as old fashioned on the N64.  They need something that gives the console real value, where people feel they HAVE to buy a Wii U or they'll miss out on the next big videogame experience.  That's the one thing the Wii did right that made people buy it.

Fix it or replace it.  Putting a nice bow on it isn't going to do a thing.

smallsharkbigbiteJanuary 20, 2014

Quote from: Stratos

Or we could do a true deluxe release with the Wii U XL and make the Gamepad capable of playing 3DS games.

Gamepad is the bottom screen, 3d tv is the top screen.  Wii U is capable of replicating 3d games now.  Assassins Creed 3 (Wii U edition) has stereoscopic 3d option.  Besides, now that Nintendo is promoting the 2ds, certainly the 3ds games could be presented on the wii u. 

Quote:

Who here owns a Wii U and would be so offended by it being discontinued that they would not buy Nintendo's next console?  And Nintendo did do this before with the Virtual Boy.  They decided that killing the thing and pretending it never existed was the best course of action and it didn't seem to have any negative impact on consumer trust.

You owned a Wii but not a Wii U.  I own a Wii U.  If they kill it within 2 years, I won't own a successor for many years.  It just took me longer than you to realize Nintendo isn't the company, anymore, that gave me my love of video games.  I'm not going to argue the Wii U is great hardware, it isn't.  But it's not terrible hardware either.  Nintendo has a serious software problem.  Just releasing a new console doesn't fix that.  A new console could be part of that fix, but nothing I've seen from Nintendo recently indicates that they can fix the problem.  You seem to indicate yourself that the Wii U hardware isn't necessarily the problem. 

Quote:

The hell with marketing and name changes, how about Nintendo do something to get some fucking games released and actually make the Wii U a decent product?

Quote:

I have a feeling most of the existing Wii U owners are such Nintendo nuts that Miyamoto could **** in a box and they would buy it.

Miyamoto should have been in Iwata's shoes, but he didn't want it.  He's had an incredible career even if every game he's produced isn't solid gold.  That said, he's told Nintendo to prepare for a future without him.  He's more a visionary than a lover of video games.  My guess is he doesn't make the jump to Nintendo's next console, especially as pressure increases on Nintendo to conform to industry standards. 

BlackNMild2k1January 20, 2014

It was one of my suggestions (in a different thread I think?) that Nintendo allow NOA & NOE to operate more autonomously. Letting NOA decide what Retro and subsequent US 1st/2nd parties are working on, and who to work with to make whatever games another branch doesn't currently have dibs on. Letting NOE create a new Rare and handle all European development and marketing and such.

Nintendo doesn't even seem interested in selling us the old software that they already have ready to go in the form of Virtual Console, so I'm not really sure what they are thinking when it comes to supplying the Wii U audience with much needed games to play.

The Wii U is literally set up to be a 3DS player, and yet, that bit of obviousness (to us, since E3 2011 reveal) has yet to dawn on them, as I'm sure they surely could have capitalized on it in some way or another at this point.

Everything that Nintendo is doing on the software front is lacking in effort and far short of any perceived potential.

and even if Nintendo was ready to drop new hardware this summer to replace the Wii U, it still wouldn't have any software ready to go till the maybe next year as 3rd parties would be slow to port and hesitant to support. Nintendo is having trouble keeping up with Wii U development, so lets go and match or trump PS4 level specs and see what happens now. Oh, further delays to games that were already late to begin with.

I don't think they have much of a choice but to try and salvage the Wii U, and if they are going to leverage any success and push for a replacement system to generate income, I sincerely hope they think outside the box, attempt to strike new ground, surprise the competition and stay ahead of the curve by putting some serious R&D into a "Hybrid" device. a 3rd wheel device for the meantime with long term potential of replacing the 3DS and short term potential of phasing out the Wii U slowly till a proper replacement system can be put forth. (I know,  I know, not this damn hybrid talk again, but I really think the idea makes sense as an option to be explored. Someone is gonna do it sooner or later, and Nintendo needs a new "WOW" factor to generate that "fire sale" HYPE)

smallsharkbigbiteJanuary 20, 2014

Quote from: BlackNMild2k1

The Wii U is literally set up to be a 3DS player, and yet, that bit of obviousness (to us, since E3 2011 reveal) has yet to dawn on them, as I'm sure they surely could have capitalized on it in some way or another at this point.

I think the problem is that their are no expansion ports on the Wii U to allow for playing 3DS cartridges and their online systems are far from being able to allow people who own 3DS titles to be able to download them for free.  Sure they could release 3DS games for $40, but what incentive would 3DS owners have to re-buy their games. 

Quote:

if Nintendo was ready to drop new hardware this summer to replace the Wii U, it still wouldn't have any software ready to go till the maybe next year as 3rd parties would be slow to port and hesitant to support.

I think this is the biggest argument for keeping the Wii U.  You can argue consumers would get over the Wii U getting cut early, but it's hard to argue that 3rd parties will suddenly support the next system after this failure.  And reality is the Wii U has sold about 5.8 million units.  That's not a colossal failure.  It's almost a third of gamecube sales already.  Sure, in the modern era that's a disappointment, but far from a vitual boy which didn't even crack 1 million units sold. 

Quote:

(I know,  I know, not this damn hybrid talk again,

Must....resist....urge....to argue about hybrid. 

BlackNMild2k1January 20, 2014

Quote from: smallsharkbigbite

Quote from: BlackNMild2k1

The Wii U is literally set up to be a 3DS player, and yet, that bit of obviousness (to us, since E3 2011 reveal) has yet to dawn on them, as I'm sure they surely could have capitalized on it in some way or another at this point.

I think the problem is that their are no expansion ports on the Wii U to allow for playing 3DS cartridges and their online systems are far from being able to allow people who own 3DS titles to be able to download them for free.  Sure they could release 3DS games for $40, but what incentive would 3DS owners have to re-buy their games. 

But it was apparent to us even before the system launched. Plenty of time for Nintendo to add a 3DS gameslot under the flap on the Wii U.

We are past a year after launch and their eShop is still not what it should be and accounts are still not unified and countless other things that people want to make excuses for that Nintendo still hasn't done that they could have, and appear to be taking their sweet ass time towards that already should have.

At what point during the failing decline do they panic and start to take action? They aren't even playing towards their strengths, so am I supposed to have confidence in them addressing their weaknesses? I'm glad they finally got the wake up call (guess they can only hit snooze on that alarm for so long) but at this pace, they would have shown up late to their own funeral.

They've bypassed so many opportunities to shut me up and take my money that it's not even funny anymore. I can't even recommend that a friend buy the system regardless of their love for Nintendo style games at this point. It's a wait and see game, and it shouldn't be like that.

January 30th needs to hurry up and come so we can see what lessons Iwata has learned and what actions he plans to take to steer his company straight. I would hate to have to hang my Nintendo hat in my nostalgia closet because they just aren't who they used to be to me anymore. It's not too late to fix things, but they can't just sit there and pretend like they aren't even losing mindshare among some of their oldest and most loyal fans.

CericJanuary 21, 2014

Flat out the Wii U's biggest problem in the end I think is Marketing and Branding.  The Non-Nintendo Loyalist barely know that the system exists.  That its the next system.  Though the XBox One is also having a bit of that problem outside of the gaming crowd as well.

They really need to ReBrand and ReMarket.  Nintendo has lost T-AO this generation as a primary focus.  That shipped sailed as soon as they squandered their year lead and the PS4 and XBone shipped.  They need to focus on a new niche.  That would be E-T.

Currently the PS4 and XBone really don't have any good titles catering to that crowd.  Nintendo needs to be the place for that.  A slight UI redesign to make it kid friendlier.  A Wii Q that does DVD and Blu-Ray.  I can buy a Wii U with Skylanders for $250.  To do that they need mindshare with the 5-12 audience.  I go as far to say as releasing a Captain N like series on Netflix featuring Wii U.  Support Education and have Wii U software geared towards education to get it in Schools at a discounted School price.

They need to get out of those Transparent Cubes they have been stuck in.

EiksirfJanuary 21, 2014

I agree with Ceric. I personally think Nintendo is hurting simply because of image. They have good hardware and software, but they went all-in last gen on casual gamers who got tired of the Wii and abandoned them mid-way through its life cycle. A big portion of their core audience moved on last gen and with such good alternatives, they've stayed away.

There may not be a quick fix for Wii U, but they can lay the ground work toward building a successful console in the future, but it might mean doing some non-Nintendo-like things like publishing mature games and franchises alongside Mario, Zelda and Pokemon - and then marketing everything effectively, and to the right audiences.

In the meantime, find effective ways to market things like Super Smash Bros. U. Imagine they shelled out for a Super Bowl spot and let a marketing company design the ad? They could generate some buzz and start bringing gamers back immediately.

The shovelware for Wii changed their image, and they need to steer it back to what sells. They found a hot niche genre last gen that sold like crazy, but like those guitar controllers, it didn't end up being a longterm product.

AdrockJanuary 21, 2014

Quote from: BlackNMild2k1

But it was apparent to us even before the system launched. Plenty of time for Nintendo to add a 3DS gameslot under the flap on the Wii U.

I'm baffled every time I see this suggested. If this was anyone's expectation, consider reevaluating reality. First, Nintendo either raises the price of Wii U (which some people already balked at) or they essentially give a 3DS away for free. Why would anyone think Nintendo would do that? Second, enabling this functionality is likely a lot more work for Nintendo than people think it is. I'm not exactly sure what the payoff is for Nintendo. They want to sell two systems, not hurt 3DS sales to increase Wii U sales.

Nintendo's problem is that they didn't do a good job of communicating the value of Wii U. While I thoroughly enjoy my Wii U, I can admit that. It serves my purposes as someone who doesn't play a lot of video games. For everyone else, it's unacceptably inadequate. Even if one could play 3DS games via Wii U, the Wii U part of the console would still be lacking. A console should be able to stand on its own merits, not on the shoulders of another. If Nintendo ever wanted to introduce a 3DS Player, I would understand that more though I'm still convinced 3DS games would be significantly worse played on a TV/GamePad combo.

EiksirfJanuary 21, 2014

Quote from: Ian

Here's something to think about: what impact is this piece of news going to have on the Wii U's future?  Now I don't expect the average Joe to even know about this but any hardcore gamer knows and is probably thinking that the Wii U has no future and that they shouldn't buy one.

That's me, actually. I haven't been buying new consoles since the Xbox 360 and Wii came through, so I'm cautious with my spending. My Wii just broke and I was faced with $85 to repair it and play the new game I got for Christmas, or $300 for a Wii U upgrade. I was on the fence and leaning toward Wii U until I read Iwata's latest about changing Nintendo's business model. That and the poor Wii U sales had me thinking Nintendo will abandon this console and I wouldn't get my money's worth like I have with the 360. I went with the $85 repair and probably won't be getting a Wii U at all now. This would be the only Nintendo console I've never purchased.

BlackNMild2k1January 21, 2014

Quote from: Adrock

Quote from: BlackNMild2k1

But it was apparent to us even before the system launched. Plenty of time for Nintendo to add a 3DS gameslot under the flap on the Wii U.

I'm baffled every time I see this suggested. If this was anyone's expectation, consider reevaluating reality. First, Nintendo either raises the price of Wii U (which some people already balked at) or they essentially give a 3DS away for free. Why would anyone think Nintendo would do that? Second, enabling this functionality is likely a lot more work for Nintendo than people think it is. I'm not exactly sure what the payoff is for Nintendo. They want to sell two systems, not hurt 3DS sales to increase Wii U sales.

Nintendo's problem is that they didn't do a good job of communicating the value of Wii U. While I thoroughly enjoy my Wii U, I can admit that. It serves my purposes as someone who doesn't play a lot of video games. For everyone else, it's unacceptably inadequate. Even if one could play 3DS games via Wii U, the Wii U part of the console would still be lacking. A console should be able to stand on its own merits, not on the shoulders of another. If Nintendo ever wanted to introduce a 3DS Player, I would understand that more though I'm still convinced 3DS games would be significantly worse played on a TV/GamePad combo.

I'm not actually suggesting that Nintendo should have added a 3DS player the Wii U out of the gate, I'm was more venting that there are plenty ways to add value to the Wii U and Nintendo didn't really pursue any of them. Money was left on the table as they took the "good enough" approach once again. They banked so hard that we would all be blown away by a "tablet" controller that can operate like a handheld on your couch that they forgot to add or plan for a few things that seemed quite obvious to the rest of us.
-Like multi-touch. May not be a necessity, but it would certainly make certain things more intuitive when using a touch screen.
-Second game pad support. Nintendo didn't even consider the idea add it was one if the first things that everyone kinda got excited about.
-The Wii U could be a 3DS player and the Wii U already looks like a Wii, so maybe they should make a small side flap with an expansion port for a future accessory.
-Game pad remote for tv and cable is good and Nintendo thought it was "great" but it could have been so much more, same with the TVii service, it just didn't take the execution of the idea far enough, lots of room for completion to come in and trump you.
-multi tasking built in features like video chat & internet surfing while playing games our watching videos, or playing simple games the game pad while watching videos on the TV.

There are plenty of other examples of Nintendo picking the fruit long before it was ripe, and I'm sure that's a big reason the sour taste in a lot peoples mouths. The system just didn't turn out to be what most if is hoped it would, and on top of that it was slow, and Nintendo was being even slower to fix it. The system is half baked, poorly marketed & under supported.

A relaunch with a new design would be a good place to start. some software value adding could help (better remote app, upgrade TVii, support and advertise the VC, more entertainment apps, better bundles, eShop credit, unified accounts & a 3DS channel for demos and downloaded games), maybe even adding that 3DS card slot under the flap and pushing 3DS connectivity would garner some much needed attention.

Ian SaneJanuary 21, 2014

While I don't think poor marketing is the main cause of the Wii U's failure or that improved marketing will save it, I can say that Nintendo really botched it.  When the PS4 and XB1 were close to release a lot of the guys in my office were talking about it.  The Wii U came up and one of the guys who plays videogames asked "when is that coming out?"  The console had been out for a whole year and he didn't know it had been released but he damn well knew when the other consoles were coming out.  My brother also had no idea the Wii U had come out when I was talking about it with him a few months ago.  He got noticeably confused in what I was saying and stopped me to say "Wait.  Is this thing already out?"

AdrockJanuary 21, 2014

I would probably rank their marketing fourth.

1. Lack of consistent first party titles
2. Poor third party relationships
3. Unfinished system software
4. Inadequate/near-nonexistent marketing

I include the name and console design in marketing because if Nintendo did any of that correctly, this wouldn't be as much of an issue. At the very least people should know it's new. For the people who did, almost everything else about it viewed in a mostly unpleasant light. The lineup wasn't terrible, just thin. The menus ran slow as shit and was missing touted features like TVii. Nintendo has launched far too many consoles and handhelds not to at least get the basics right.

CericJanuary 21, 2014

I could agree with your list if it started with point 2.  Point 1 I think there first party games have been consistent.  If you meant scheduled poorly I still wouldn't put that at 1.

BlackNMild2k1January 21, 2014

If #4 was done correctly, #2 might have been better.

If #2 was already better, then they would have had more material to do #4 correctly

So basically, if they had bothered to generate hype through proper marketing, 3rd parties probably wouldn't have been so hesitant to support the system, and then the 1st party game drought wouldn't have been as noticeable and we would have been so busy playing games, that the incomplete apps would have been more forgivable.

Good Job Nintendo.

AdrockJanuary 21, 2014

On Nintendo's platforms, there's nothing more important than their own software. It's pretty inexcusable to have almost nothing between launch and Pikmin 3. Nintendo needs to be more consistent in scheduling releases. Game and Wario is not going to get it done. And really, neither is Pikmin 3. Ideally, they should have at least one big title on both console and handheld per quarter. If they can't handle that, expand and fix it.

I ranked marketing fourth because if Nintendo did at least the bare minimum they would have at least had good word of mouth. They did less than that which is sad and mind-boggling. I like Wii U and it was still hard to recommend it to someone on the fence. It's a good console with plenty of potential, but potential is abstract; you can't play with potential. I would tell people they could afford to wait. If they did, a lot of things improved, not to the point where they should be, but certainly much better than at launch.

Ian SaneJanuary 21, 2014

I think it would be easier to describe what Nintendo did right with the Wii U.

Um... many of their first party games turned out to be good.  Now I think the choice of what games to make (too many casual party games, too many 2D platformers, too many games that seemingly have 3DS equivalents thus making it so Nintendo fans don't even need a Wii U to get their fix) was largely idiotic and they released games too infrequently.

They pretty much fucked up everything else.  The price was too high, the marketing sucks, the name is stupid and created confusion about the Wii U being a new system, the system was vastly underpowered and released a mere year before the competition lapped it, there is still typical Nintendo goofiness in online features, the VC is neglected and ignored, the interface is clunky, the controller has not been utilized in any meaningful way, the third party support sucks, Nintendo seemingly abandoned the Wii for the last two years of its life and killed any momentum they had and then followed that up with software droughts on the Wii U because they didn't realize HD games take more resources and time to make even though they POINTED THAT OUT THEMSELVES YEARS AGO.  I swear it's a damn miracle the Wii U runs on electricity because Nintendo damn near fucked up everything else.

Nintendo has no idea why the Wii was successful so they tried to duplicate everything about it, good or bad, and unfortunately they were wrong in thinking the Wii U's controller gimmick would catch on like the Wii's.  It is like every shitty element that the Wii succeeded DESPITE of has been amplified.

EiksirfJanuary 21, 2014

Wii was so successful because it was the Tickle Me Elmo, the Furby, the Rainbow Loom: the catchy thing that a large audience buys into for a little while. And then when it was time to move on, Nintendo missed the boat.

There was a huge audience for a little while, but it's gone now and so it's time to do the difficult: get PS and Xbox gamers back interested in a new Nintendo system.

Nintendo doesn't need third party games as badly as you'd think, those are already available elsewhere. They need people to take notice of what's good and unique on Wii U, but if people don't even know the system exists yet, they're not buying Mario, Luigi, Zelda or anything. They don't know about the tablet. They don't know enough to even care if it has multi-touch or backwards compatibility or a fancy home menu or robust online platform. All those things are important to some degree, but first people need a reason to care, and then Nintendo has to impress them beyond that once they buy in.

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