Author Topic: Mario Kart comfirmed! or comfirmed?  (Read 15746 times)

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Offline Savior

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RE:Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #25 on: April 02, 2005, 07:10:30 PM »
Quote

Including online in a game is pandering to a minority, as far as I know.


Hmm. If Online fans were a "minority" then the DS wouldnt be getting online games. Really, the world evolved around more than just you and this extreme anti online fanatism of yours. They wouldnt be making an investment and a partnership with Gamespy if it was a "minority"

Oh and once again, ill be shocked shocked if MK isnt online.  
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Offline IceCold

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RE:Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2005, 07:22:44 PM »
Well, Paladin isn't really against online, I don't think. He just doesn't want Nintendo to focus on online at the expense of the game quality, or if the game is released later.
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Offline PaLaDiN

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #27 on: April 02, 2005, 07:26:41 PM »
Is that right. Then explain to me how Xbox Live players form a minority of Xbox owners?

"Extreme anti online fanaticism"? Right, good for you. You've figured me out. I'm a brainless moron who hates online for no reason whatsoever. There's no point arguing with an idiot like me, you're better off spending your truly dizzying intellect on somebody else.

Don't bother, IceCold, I've been trying for a while now. You win a cookie though.

Why are you still arguing with me, Savior? You've already figured me out. My argument is stupid and holds no water. My whole stance "against" online is baseless and idiotic. Why are you beating a dead horse?

"Splinter Cell Chaos Theory, actually had the best single player mode of all 3 according to the critics. Its got one of the most popular online multiplayer modes on Xbox live as well. Its an ok argument but if the developer is good, its not gonna happen."

Yes, and the online component took absolutely no time to implement. It just magically appeared on developers' desks. There was no time they spent on online that they could instead have spent making the single player even better. It's just too bad I played the demo and walked away thoroughly unimpressed... that's my fault though, not the developers'. Oh, and the Xbox situation is exactly the same as the DS situation, because the Xbox is also currently suffering from a severe lack of good games.
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Offline Savior

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #28 on: April 02, 2005, 07:34:38 PM »
Every post of yours on the subject ive seen is the same "No online!, The Majority of Gamers dont Want Online" rhetoric.

Simply using Xbox live as an example, is slightly biassed.

Never the less, you still dont explain why 1.If we (im pro online) are a minority why would Nintendo care? and 2.Whats the problem with Mario Kart being online? I dont understand why it would have to be delayed to get it online, last time i checked it didnt have a set release date, except it was near to Animal Crossing Onlines release date. Its also logical to think that Nintendo wouldnt announce a Full Online Program with One game.  


Quote

Nintendo to focus on online at the expense of the game quality,


Splinter Cell Chaos Theory, actually had the best single player mode of all 3 according to the critics. Its got one of the most popular online multiplayer modes on Xbox live as well. Its an ok argument but if the developer is good, its not gonna happen.  
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Offline Mario

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #29 on: April 02, 2005, 08:07:27 PM »
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I'm saying offline and early is better than online.

I thought you might have implied that for a second but then i dismissed it because it just sounds so absurd. Adding online would not delay the title significantly, and Nintendo's release schedule doesn't really revolve around when a title is done, they release it. Look at Kirby DS for example, ready to go right now, but they're delaying it until June. Ignoring that, I'd still rather wait longer for a better product. Look at Wind Waker, two dungeons taken out to get the game released in time, wouldn't you rather have them in it? I certainly would.
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Is that right. Then explain to me how Xbox Live players form a minority of Xbox owners?

Because Xbox Live is expensive.

Offline darknight06

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #30 on: April 02, 2005, 08:10:22 PM »
"Well, Paladin isn't really against online, I don't think. He just doesn't want Nintendo to focus on online at the expense of the game quality, or if the game is released later."

And I can definitely agree with this logic.  However, on the same note this game is supposed to be released in Europe quite soon if I'm not mistaken.  If so then that means the game would have to be pretty far along by now wouldn't it?  Chances are they're probably almost done with the game anyhow, it's running at a solid 60fps, and feedback has been quite positive about it.

Now also consider when the US version is supposedly going to be released.  (Q4)  Besides language, what do you think they'll be doing with a pretty much finished game in the meantime.  I highly doubt it's just going to sit there and do nothing for a few months time...

Offline PaLaDiN

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #31 on: April 02, 2005, 08:29:44 PM »
"Ignoring that, I'd still rather wait longer for a better product."

Yes, but would you want to wait longer for a product that doesn't enhance your experience in any way? Surely you can see what I'm getting at. What if Nintendo delayed Wind Waker to add more seagulls? That's what adding online is like to me, adding more birds. I recognize that other people want online, just like I'm sure there are people out there with a bird fetish, but that doesn't really relate to me, and I wouldn't want a game to take longer to come out just to appease those people... especially not if it was delayed at a time when the Gamecube had a serious image problem of not having enough good games.

"Now also consider when the US version is supposedly going to be released. (Q4) Besides language, what do you think they'll be doing with a pretty much finished game in the meantime. I highly doubt it's just going to sit there and do nothing for a few months time..."

Yeah, I want to know what's taking them so long. Why isn't Mario Kart out now? It should be out NOW. This is when Nintendo needs it. If they delayed it just to add online, then they've proved my point.  

Just to clear up any confusion, "game A comes out somewhat later than it would have, even though no release date had been mentioned" amounts to "game A was delayed" in my book.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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RE:Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #32 on: April 02, 2005, 10:01:49 PM »
Quote

Originally posted by: PaLaDiN
Yes, but would you want to wait longer for a product that doesn't enhance your experience in any way? Surely you can see what I'm getting at.
Yeah its all about you. You want it now, and you are ignoring the bigger picture.
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"Ignoring that, I'd still rather wait longer for a better product."
That is what benefits everyone the most.

PaLaDiN what make you think that even though you wouldn't initially use the online capabilities of the game, that once you have beaten the game to death and no longer find it fun from lack of challenge, that maybe you wouldn't try out the online mode for additional challenges and also find that down the line that it really did enhance your replay experience by extending it indefinately.

Don't you think that if MK64 (DD wasn't as good imho) & GE was online that all of us might still have our 64's hooked up? Would we even be worried that we have beaten all challenges and all of our friends, now where is the sequel?

A year from now I don't wanna be asked about MK DS and reply "Oh yeah that game was cool for a while"
I wanna reply "Oh Yeah. I'm playing it right now!!!"

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Yeah, I want to know what's taking them so long. Why isn't Mario Kart out now? It should be out NOW. This is when Nintendo needs it. If they delayed it just to add online, then they've proved my point.
I personally think it should be out when it is done. Make it the most complete and memorable experience now, that will only make it even more worth my gaming dollars.  

If your point is to appeal to those that want a game now that leaves them wanting more, instead of giving the game a little more time, leaving everyone thinking that they couldn't have asked for more, then I really have nothing left to say........
 

Offline Savior

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #33 on: April 02, 2005, 10:05:42 PM »
Adding online adds to the games Replay factor.

How does adding seaguls add to replay ? Im not going to replay the game if theres more seaguls. Its not the same thing


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Offline PaLaDiN

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #34 on: April 02, 2005, 10:11:10 PM »
Argh. Is everybody ignoring my point on purpose?

"Yeah its all about you. You want it now, and you are ignoring the bigger picture."

It's not just about me. There are plenty of people who want good games for the DS NOW. Not later. You're missing the bigger picture too... you want online, whether it means Nintendo has to shoot themselves in the foot or not. The DS is currently experiencing a drought of good games. You're asking Nintendo to prolong that drought so you get games you will enjoy a little more.

"That is what benefits everyone the most."

You guys need to stop it with this stupid attitude. It doesn't benefit everyone the most if it means the game has to be delayed. What about the people who don't care about online? There's more of those than the people who do, you know. Why should they have to wait just so that you can play the way you want to? You're being just as selfish as you say I am... it's just I'm the only one acknowledging my selfishness.

"I personally think it should be out when it is done. Make it the most complete and memorable experience now, that will only make it even more worth my gaming dollars."

Funny, I share the same philosophy. Here's the difference: adding online does not make it more worth my gaming dollars. Now, you can delude yourself and think that I'm alone here, or you can wise up and realize this issue isn't black and white and your solution doesn't satisfy every person on the planet.

"Adding online adds to the games Replay factor.

How does adding seaguls add to replay ? Im not going to replay the game if theres more seaguls. Its not the same thing"

See... there you go. You've got the same attitude towards birds that I have towards online. To people with a bird fetish, adding birds adds to the game's enjoyability. If you want me to rephrase it in terms of replayability, fine: how about each time you play the game through again, there are more birds? Doesn't that strike you as a thoroughly useless waste of development time? That's what online is to me.

Adding online doesn't add to the games Replay factor for everybody. What about people who don't have broadband? What about people like me who don't care about online? Stop treating your opinions as fact.

"Mario Kart isn't coming out in June. There's no difference between September and November. If it was a delay from may to November, mayb you'd have a point. But as far as we can tell it'll be late summer at the earliest."

Yes there is a big difference. Right now is when people are deciding which portable to buy. If Sony comes out with a killer app in September and Nintendo delayed Mario Kart from September to November to add online, there goes a whole lot of people to Sony's side.

Anyway, I'm out of here. Have fun missing my point and convincing yourself it doesn't exist a little more.  

Alright, one more.

"I'm missing where online adds so much time to the dev process."

Hence all the "if"s in my arguments? I'm concerned with the hypothetical situation that online means longer dev time, which makes sense to me. You would think that somebody would by now have comforted me and said it was just hypothetical and making stuff online was a lot easier than I thought it was and the reason Mario Kart is taking so long to come out has nothing to do with Nintendo adding online... but no, it seems people want to give me a heart attack by repeatedly and obstinately attacking my opinion that online isn't enjoyable with theirs that it is.
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Offline Artimus

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #35 on: April 02, 2005, 10:17:51 PM »
Your argument would be much better if there was any reason to think that it was going to be delayed because of online.

Have you never played a game online? Do you not realize that a small percentage of gamers doesn't mean a small number of gamers? Do you not realize the potential of being able to play multiplayer games anytime without needing friends with systems? Do you not realize if the game is going online it will be one of the main features and not some side thing they're delaying it a year just to add at the last minute?

Mario Kart isn't coming out in June. There's no difference between September and November. If it was a delay from may to November, mayb you'd have a point. But as far as we can tell it'll be late summer at the earliest.

Offline Bloodworth

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #36 on: April 02, 2005, 10:30:52 PM »
I'm missing where online adds so much time to the dev process.  Nintendo's already implementing wireless multiplayer, so most of your programming issues are going to have to be addressed anyways.  They've said that devs should be able to expand their current multiplayer titles to include online without much effort.  Plus, the guys working on the online stuff would most likely do it while other parts of the team are building the courses, etc.  

Also, you can say what you want about delays, but do you think Goldeneye would have even been noticed if they didn't throw in multiplayer at the last minute?  

With a free, wireless, and easy-to-use connection, Nintendo could cause a huge expansion in the online market, so it may benefit more people than you think.  
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Offline IceCold

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RE:Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #37 on: April 02, 2005, 10:35:09 PM »
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See... there you go. You've got the same attitude towards birds that I have towards online.
Paladin just nailed it there. Haven't you guys heard of the saying, "To each his own.."??? Geez
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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RE:Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #38 on: April 02, 2005, 10:49:08 PM »
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Originally posted by: Bloodworth
Also, you can say what you want about delays, but do you think Goldeneye would have even been noticed if they didn't throw in multiplayer at the last minute?
Do you think we would have ever put down (last gen) if it was also online?

 

Offline Mario

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #39 on: April 02, 2005, 10:51:44 PM »
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It's not just about me. There are plenty of people who want good games for the DS NOW. Not later.

There are already good games now.
Quote

What about the people who don't care about online? There's more of those than the people who do, you know.

I think you're wrong there. What are you basing this on? The fact that people didn't want to pay for Xbox Live?

Offline Don'tHate742

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #40 on: April 02, 2005, 10:52:49 PM »
What the hell?! I go away from this thread for a second and it turns into is Online good or not?

Damn Paladin, you must see that maybe.....just maybe you'll enjoy an online experience. You can say no...NEVER! But you never know, an online MarioKart would be halarious wouldn't it?

As for this thread...it went to hell.....Bloodworth lock it if you want...
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Offline Mario

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #41 on: April 02, 2005, 10:56:54 PM »
How dare we have a debate!

Offline PaLaDiN

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #42 on: April 02, 2005, 11:01:51 PM »
I try to get out, and they keep pulling me back in...

"Damn Paladin, you must see that maybe.....just maybe you'll enjoy an online experience. You can say no...NEVER! But you never know, an online MarioKart would be halarious wouldn't it?"

No. My honeymoon with online came and went half a decade ago. We're the bitter divorced couple now.

"I think you're wrong there. What are you basing this on? The fact that people didn't want to pay for Xbox Live?"

Let's ignore the people like me for the moment... what about the people who don't have the capability to go online in the first place? Last I heard, those numbers were still pretty high.

"Do you think we would have ever put down (last gen) if it was also online?"

Wow, you have really high expectations of online gaming... you know, I was once like you. I predict you'll be as thoroughly bored and jaded with online in a few years as I am now.

I second the motion to lock this thread. This isn't a debate, it's more of an uncoordinated mass gang assault against one or two people. I need some help dealing with the sheer volume.
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Offline Mario

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #43 on: April 02, 2005, 11:11:55 PM »
Quote

Let's ignore the people like me for the moment... what about the people who don't have the capability to go online in the first place? Last I heard, those numbers were still pretty high.

All you need is a Nintendo DS. I don't see why people without a Nintendo DS would buy Mario Kart DS.

Offline IceCold

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RE:Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #44 on: April 02, 2005, 11:11:58 PM »
Well, I can't say I didn't try to end it with my little quote, but I guess no one listened..
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Offline PaLaDiN

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #45 on: April 02, 2005, 11:17:43 PM »
"All you need is a Nintendo DS. I don't see why people without a Nintendo DS would buy Mario Kart DS."

I was talking more in general for that one, but whatever. You'll need a wireless router and a broadband connection as well, unless I'm mistaken.
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Offline KDR_11k

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #46 on: April 03, 2005, 08:04:11 AM »
Adding online would not delay the title significantly

Please? I've seen figures that estimate online play takes about 1/3rd of a game's development time to implement properly and test thoroughly.

Offline darknight06

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #47 on: April 03, 2005, 08:20:57 AM »
"I was talking more in general for that one, but whatever. You'll need a wireless router and a broadband connection as well, unless I'm mistaken."

Yep, and unless you plan to visit your local hotspot for your daily Mario Kart fix, getting a router will run you from $60 to $100 depending on how much you want it to do and what kind of quality you want as well.  

Offline Savior

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RE:Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #48 on: April 03, 2005, 08:55:19 AM »
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well, unless I'm mistaken.


you could go to Starbucks, or any other local wifi hot spot, (And theres tons of those in USA)

Your right in saying that theres extra complicated stuff to go online. But thats why Nintendo wants to simplify the process. Not only that but by subsidizingthe online process to Gamespy, that allows Nintendo to spend more time producing the game itself. Hence, a faster, and better product. Which should appease you.

Oh and while Broadband induction is smaller, it has gone up substantially. By the time The Revolution hits, it should be even higher an cheaper.  Going against it now, is like stopping a train. Its inevitable.
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Offline Artimus

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RE: Mario Kart Online comfirmed! or comfirmed?
« Reply #49 on: April 03, 2005, 09:33:46 AM »
Paladin, did it ever occur to you that Nintendo has held your stance but now they've changed? Maybe because they're making it EASIER and BETTER to go online?

Whoever mentioned wireless multiplayer was right on. The software has to be in there if you want ANY multiplayer, the programming is already done. And Nintendo has to encourage other people to go online with their own games or no other company will (see: Gamecube). You said you had a nasty divorce with online. Well, tough love. It will not take 1/3 longer to add online. We are living in a new world and the possibilities of having a wireless DS where you can play anyone in the world are exciting. Perhaps it will suck, but surely it's worth Nintendo taking a shot? Maybe it'll be simple, easy and an amazing way to play the DS?