Topic: A particular subgroup of the Nintendo fan base annoys me greatly.

[lolmonade]

I guess I'd be one of those "Grey area" people.  Bought a Wii U at launch because I wanted the Nintendo games, fully expecting that much like the Wii, Nintendo games would be the best reason to get one (although looking at my current library, it's actually 2/3 Nintendo, 1/3 3rd party, which is a better ratio than my Wii library).
 
I think Nintendo has this misconception that they're similar to Apple in that they can decide what the consumer wants, deliver it, and the gaming public will eat it up.  The problem is that Nintendo's fanbase who are that rabid is much smaller than Apple's core constituency, so even if they hit gold one time (Wii), if they falter another time (Wii U), then their fortunes fail miserably.
 
They're a video game company whose games I adore (mostly), whose hardware I've tolerated lately, and whose virtual console & online functionality is lousy compared to the competition. 
 
I've often questioned whether Nintendo actually has a passion for hardware & feature development, or whether they tolerate it as a current-day necessity because they don't see a possibility for the same level of success if they just gave up the hardware game & focused on game development, where they really shine IMO.

[marvel_moviefan_2012]

I guess I'd be one of those "Grey area" people.  Bought a Wii U at launch because I wanted the Nintendo games, fully expecting that much like the Wii, Nintendo games would be the best reason to get one (although looking at my current library, it's actually 2/3 Nintendo, 1/3 3rd party, which is a better ratio than my Wii library).
 
I think Nintendo has this misconception that they're similar to Apple in that they can decide what the consumer wants, deliver it, and the gaming public will eat it up.  The problem is that Nintendo's fanbase who are that rabid is much smaller than Apple's core constituency, so even if they hit gold one time (Wii), if they falter another time (Wii U), then their fortunes fail miserably.
 
They're a video game company whose games I adore (mostly), whose hardware I've tolerated lately, and whose virtual console & online functionality is lousy compared to the competition. 
 
I've often questioned whether Nintendo actually has a passion for hardware & feature development, or whether they tolerate it as a current-day necessity because they don't see a possibility for the same level of success if they just gave up the hardware game & focused on game development, where they really shine IMO.

But it isn't their hardware, they actually make good hardware, it is their consoles that are the problem and lack of focus. The Wii U has low specs but I don't think that matters for game development especially for Nintendo games for Nintendo they are new specs. That is why their handhelds do fine, they do release the games there people want, with their consoles they act like they take that base for granted. The problem is Nintendo does make great games but they also make lousy games that they just expect you to buy inbetween the great games and while everybody does the same their library is more noticable because they have fewer partners filling in the gaps.


I always intended to get a Wii U, but I find it hard to justify buying one at the current price. Specs or not, the console is still currently more expensive than all their past machines LAUNCHED at and there is no new tech to justify that kind of markup other than the Game Pad which for me is not worth the extra expense. I usually get in the middle of a generation when the price comes down, but the games library needs to pick up too. By the time I got a N64 and a Game Cube they had over twenty games I was interested in and were getting new games all the time, as of right now the Wii U has at most, if I am really going to lower my standards or just throw everything in there, they have at most 12 games I would buy period, that is not enough for me for the cost.


I know Phil gets upset about this and asks questions like why complain on a fansite except that is basically saying I am not a real fan, which is bullshit I love Nintendo and I might not be one of those who feel betrayed because I honestly don't care about them as a company, and like I stated before I already have a Playstation to meet my non-Nintendo needs. Personally I believe the PSX was the true successor to the Super NES and many of us are still hoping that Nintendo will pick up on that. I feel like yes they still make great games but the number of games they make that interest me declines each year. Wii at least had Virtual Console and Wii Sports to get me hooked and it took me damn near three years altogether before I got tired and sold it off, because as usual the games I was waiting for kept either getting pushed back or mentioned once and forgotten about and I personally just got tired of waiting and yeah maybe I would lose interest because damn after three years of delays you forget a game was even supposed to be coming.



I don't hate the Wii U, I just wish it had more to offer for the price. If they slashed a hundred bucks of the top right now I would get it next payday. My reason is simple, that is where the machine should have been priced by now in the first place and is inline with my expectations. I don't care if you like it fine good for you, maybe I was a little harsh in that other thread but I TOO get sick and tired of being told my views don't count and I should just shut up or go away. It is this type of thread this antagonizing that makes some of us come off as more bitter than we really are because your forcing us to defend our position but when we, god forbid, ask one of you to do the same, like I did with UB, i get told to **** off in so many words.

[rlse9]

I don't hate the Wii U, I just wish it had more to offer for the price. If they slashed a hundred bucks of the top right now I would get it next payday.

You can get a refurbished 32 GB system with Nintendoland directly from Nintendo for $200 right now: https://store.nintendo.com/ng3/browse/productDetailColorSizePicker.jsp?_DARGS=/ng3/global/gadgets/productListRangeRow.jsp.addToCartFormId

Technically not new but everything I've read is that these systems are indistinguishable from new systems.

[ShyGuy]

Only a particular subgroup?

[marvel_moviefan_2012]

I don't hate the Wii U, I just wish it had more to offer for the price. If they slashed a hundred bucks of the top right now I would get it next payday.

You can get a refurbished 32 GB system with Nintendoland directly from Nintendo for $200 right now: https://store.nintendo.com/ng3/browse/productDetailColorSizePicker.jsp?_DARGS=/ng3/global/gadgets/productListRangeRow.jsp.addToCartFormId

Technically not new but everything I've read is that these systems are indistinguishable from new systems.

I could get a used one for less too but thats besides the point. Also there are only so many refurbished ones to go around since it is you know not selling that well to begin with.

[lolmonade]

I guess I'd be one of those "Grey area" people.  Bought a Wii U at launch because I wanted the Nintendo games, fully expecting that much like the Wii, Nintendo games would be the best reason to get one (although looking at my current library, it's actually 2/3 Nintendo, 1/3 3rd party, which is a better ratio than my Wii library).
 
I think Nintendo has this misconception that they're similar to Apple in that they can decide what the consumer wants, deliver it, and the gaming public will eat it up.  The problem is that Nintendo's fanbase who are that rabid is much smaller than Apple's core constituency, so even if they hit gold one time (Wii), if they falter another time (Wii U), then their fortunes fail miserably.
 
They're a video game company whose games I adore (mostly), whose hardware I've tolerated lately, and whose virtual console & online functionality is lousy compared to the competition. 
 
I've often questioned whether Nintendo actually has a passion for hardware & feature development, or whether they tolerate it as a current-day necessity because they don't see a possibility for the same level of success if they just gave up the hardware game & focused on game development, where they really shine IMO.

But it isn't their hardware, they actually make good hardware, it is their consoles that are the problem and lack of focus. The Wii U has low specs but I don't think that matters for game development especially for Nintendo games for Nintendo they are new specs. That is why their handhelds do fine, they do release the games there people want, with their consoles they act like they take that base for granted. The problem is Nintendo does make great games but they also make lousy games that they just expect you to buy inbetween the great games and while everybody does the same their library is more noticable because they have fewer partners filling in the gaps.


I always intended to get a Wii U, but I find it hard to justify buying one at the current price. Specs or not, the console is still currently more expensive than all their past machines LAUNCHED at and there is no new tech to justify that kind of markup other than the Game Pad which for me is not worth the extra expense. I usually get in the middle of a generation when the price comes down, but the games library needs to pick up too. By the time I got a N64 and a Game Cube they had over twenty games I was interested in and were getting new games all the time, as of right now the Wii U has at most, if I am really going to lower my standards or just throw everything in there, they have at most 12 games I would buy period, that is not enough for me for the cost.


I know Phil gets upset about this and asks questions like why complain on a fansite except that is basically saying I am not a real fan, which is bullshit I love Nintendo and I might not be one of those who feel betrayed because I honestly don't care about them as a company, and like I stated before I already have a Playstation to meet my non-Nintendo needs. Personally I believe the PSX was the true successor to the Super NES and many of us are still hoping that Nintendo will pick up on that. I feel like yes they still make great games but the number of games they make that interest me declines each year. Wii at least had Virtual Console and Wii Sports to get me hooked and it took me damn near three years altogether before I got tired and sold it off, because as usual the games I was waiting for kept either getting pushed back or mentioned once and forgotten about and I personally just got tired of waiting and yeah maybe I would lose interest because damn after three years of delays you forget a game was even supposed to be coming.



I don't hate the Wii U, I just wish it had more to offer for the price. If they slashed a hundred bucks of the top right now I would get it next payday. My reason is simple, that is where the machine should have been priced by now in the first place and is inline with my expectations. I don't care if you like it fine good for you, maybe I was a little harsh in that other thread but I TOO get sick and tired of being told my views don't count and I should just shut up or go away. It is this type of thread this antagonizing that makes some of us come off as more bitter than we really are because your forcing us to defend our position but when we, god forbid, ask one of you to do the same, like I did with UB, i get told to **** off in so many words.

Wow…I'm going to assume much of this is directed towards the actual thread topic, and not myself specifically.


1)  I'm not suggesting Nintendo produces faulty hardware, just that the choices they make in regards to not trying to have near-parity with their competition makes it more difficult to port games, making the barrier to entry for 3rd parties higher (too high considering how abysmal the system is selling).  This tactic works for their handhelds because they have market dominance & inertia…for handheld, if a 3rd party wants to make a game, there isn't much better option than 3DS, because Vita's sales aren't great & mobile gaming is a crapshoot.


2)  Nintendo can't drop the price any further.  They were selling the Wii U at a loss since launch.  They dropped it $50 & started including Mario U in it, eventually added Luigi U on top of that, and THAT still wasn't enough to boost sales significantly.  They probably aren't manufacturing enough systems to get a volume cost break, & I'm assuming they're a ways-off from being able to make their manufacturing process more cost-effective, if just because I'd guess they're sitting on a mountain of inventory, considering how off their sales forecasts have been.


I actually think $300 is a fair value proposition with what they include with the system now.  Nintendo's problem with the Wii U is much deeper than the price, the name, or even the library at this point.  Frankly, I think they've still failed to convince people why they "need" a console with the gamepad, and until they really leverage unique experiences with it and ADVERTISE these new experiences, the system will just continue stumbling along.


3)  I agree that it's a good thing for there to be a diverse opinion of Nintendo, the games, & the systems they offer on this site.  It wouldn't be enjoyable to discuss things here if it was just an echo chamber all the time.  Phil's taking a lot of the negativity here lately as people being dismissive of Nintendo as a whole, but it's just a reflection of the reality we are in at the moment, and that reality is Nintendo isn't doing well to support their system, and nothing they've said since acknowledging there even is a problem really reflects a willingness to improve the situation for themselves or their customers.

[BlackNMild2k1]

3)  I agree that it's a good thing for there to be a diverse opinion of Nintendo, the games, & the systems they offer on this site.  It wouldn't be enjoyable to discuss things here if it was just an echo chamber all the time.  Phil's taking a lot of the negativity here lately as people being dismissive of Nintendo as a whole, but it's just a reflection of the reality we are in at the moment, and that reality is Nintendo isn't doing well to support their system, and nothing they've said since acknowledging there even is a problem really reflects a willingness to improve the situation for themselves or their customers.

This I agree with most.
It's no secret that Netflix was one of my most anticipated things to use the Wii U and Gamepad for.
And ever since launch, I've been waiting for them to fix it, among NUMEROUS other things and it's been like pulling teeth to get updates and even to this day Netflix still doesn't work flawlessly, nor does it have all the features, nor does it do anything unique using exclusive system features...

I can't even boast that the Wii U makes an excellent Netflix machine for the family or otherwise (thanks to the Gamepad), because
1.) There are no profiles, so you can't even access the kids/individual profiles
2.) This happens WAAAAAY too often:



I don't have this problem on the original Wii, and I have access to profiles, so I don't know what the issue is on the Wii U.

They are FINALLY just getting around to completely solving the boot up issue in June... 1.5yrs later.
TVii is still mostly just a novelty as it still (as of the last time I tried to use it) reacts too slowly and is far too limited to actually be a useful.
We still don't have folders to reduce clutter.
VC has been reset and released a trickle far slower than anything the Wii had going on, they are just now starting to ramp that up.... 1.5yrs later
Extra entertainment app have yet to show up (Pandora anyone?)
and the list could go on to point out more things, but I think the point has been made. There have been lots of issues with the Wii U that Nintendo has either dragged it's feet to address or shown no initiative to address at all, which makes recommending the Wii U to someone else that isn't really into Nintendo's own games a very hard thing to do. There is nothing that it does well enough to not suggest a better alternative outside of Nintendo games.

[ThePerm]

I dont post that often anymore because my lack of internet. The thing is Nintendo doesnt do a number of logical things that keep us happy. They do a series of random things that could possibly make us happy. The problem is its possibly, which is hit and miss. There are advantages and disadvantages to this. One of the things they need to work on is being prepared for the future. Nintendo should have had more ready at the beginning of WiiU. Now its been a year and a half and we have to wait for smash and mario kart to save the console. Nintendo has been an experiment company since wii, which has had some advantages, but you can waste your time experimenting with something that might delight us, or they could do the conventional thing that will satiaste us. They need to find a balance. That is the dilemma between artistry and commercialism. Sometimes commercial is great. I would rather have 4 twilight princesses than 1 skyward sword. Id rather have a windwaker or majoras mask than either of those. balance is key.

[MagicCow64]

The whole "Nintendo sycophants are just as bad" thing is a total strawman argument. I don't think anyone who posts here is actually like that. But somehow it's inconceivable that anyone doesn't think contemporary Nintendo is a rolling childhood memory holocaust.

The situation is just sad all around. Nintendo's doing terribly; Japan, the videogame motherland, is swiftly giving up the console ghost; game development has been steadily narrowing toward a mechanically and aesthetically homogenous target market (for major releases at least); big-budget game production has become extremely unstable; extraneous media and social features are dominating business focus; DLC and microtransactions are creeping in to more and more experiences.

Perhaps similar to Adrock, the WiiU does enough right in my book. I've been playing a lot of games lately due to acquiring a beefy laptop and trying stuff out, but historically I don't need more than a game every couple of months. I find most third-party games of little interest (as in I am sick of shooters and open-world games, and give no shits about sports in any form). I don't care about online multiplayer. I don't care about media apps. I don't care about trophies or achievements.

Now, surely that puts me in a pretty narrow demographic, and the WiiU sales would seem to verify that. One thing I hate, though, is the obsession in the gaming world about market dominance and sales. I understand a general interest, but I really can't think of any other creative sector where so much focus is put on the business side of things. Capitalism is a real shitty way to determine/assess the production of art.

[Stogi]

Remember when we all use to own the console we bitch about? I do.

Full disclosure, I don't own a Wii U. I probably won't own one until Zelda comes out next year or the year after. I still play a Wii once in a blue moon with friends (mostly Mariokart) but if it's game time, I'm either using my PS3 to play FIFA or about to shoot a zombie in the face with friends or playing some new single player game. I honestly don't play Nintendo games anymore.

I still enjoy them. I still want to enjoy them. But I lack the motivation to throw down several hundred dollars to do so. And I honestly think that there are people on this forum who are the same way. It's either that or it's buyers remorse.

Nintendo's Wii and Wii U are extremely polarizing topics. Despite how shitty some thought the Gamecube was during it's time, most generally think that the games were fantastic and the controller was God's gift to man. The Wii? That still brings up hurt feelings and the Wii U only adds salt to the wounds.

There are going to be a particular subgroup that will always bitch about Nintendo (justified or not), but because the systems today are so primed for such angst, it's easy to see why it is more popular now. It's honestly getting harder and harder to enjoy these forums, and while I could go elsewhere for my Nintendo news, I've been here far too long to simply move on; there are too many people I like to hear from or play games with.

So I guess what I'm saying is: this particular subgroup may bitch about Nintendo perpetually for all I care, but keep this forum full of goofiness and news and I'll be around for the good times and the bad until Nintendo implodes or gaming ceases to be fun anymore.

[marvel_moviefan_2012]

EDIT;

[BlackNMild2k1]

Remember when we all use to own the console we bitch about? I do.

So I guess what I'm saying is: this particular subgroup may bitch about Nintendo perpetually for all I care, but keep this forum full of goofiness and news and I'll be around for the good times and the bad until Nintendo implodes or gaming ceases to be fun anymore.

Amen brother. amen.