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Podcast Discussion / Re: Episode 238: RFN Backstage Assault!
« on: April 12, 2011, 11:24:38 AM »
AfterBurner Climax is kind of like Panzer Dragoon.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: Episode 238: RFN Backstage Assault!
« on: April 12, 2011, 10:41:06 AM »
Hey, I'm playing the exact same games as James! Weird. (Maybe not, since one was on sale, and the other is a launch game, but still...)
And I agree with Jonny about the Hori controller. The D-Pad is just too stiff, although maybe it would be better once worn in. I didn't know it was valuable, either. I should sell mine, as well.
Have you guys ever played GBA games on the GB Player with an arcade stick? Pretty awesome.
And I agree with Jonny about the Hori controller. The D-Pad is just too stiff, although maybe it would be better once worn in. I didn't know it was valuable, either. I should sell mine, as well.
Have you guys ever played GBA games on the GB Player with an arcade stick? Pretty awesome.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: Episode 34: Best of 2010 Part 2
« on: January 06, 2011, 07:18:53 PM »
Agreed. I loved the hell out of 'Splosion Man, and Comic Jumper had a cool premise and good writing, but I couldn't believe how bad the gameplay was in the demo. Gunstar Heroes meets Guardian Heroes meets ass.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: Episode 34: Best of 2010 Part 2
« on: January 04, 2011, 09:51:41 AM »
(Were the last 9 minutes blank, though, or is my iPod dying?)
Oh, you couldn't hear it? Damn and that was the best part.
It was still the best part.
j/k!
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RFN Live: The Recording (Part 3)
« on: January 03, 2011, 06:30:45 PM »
I would've taken the plushie, but I thought they were all gone. Props to UncleBob for the WiiWare game, though.
Also, I am hereby striking the words "like" and "y'know" from my vocabulary. UGH.
Also, I am hereby striking the words "like" and "y'know" from my vocabulary. UGH.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: Episode 34: Best of 2010 Part 2
« on: January 03, 2011, 06:27:57 PM »
Twilight Princess was awesome, a huge refinement of the 3D Zelda formula that was absolutely stuffed with quality, fresh content (read: PUZZLES), and I think Skyward Sword will be all things to all people. Voice acting would make the game interminable, like most games these days are.
And you guys were way too harsh on Shantae (even though you liked it).
That said, this was a really enjoyable episode. I started tuning in after the charity show, and I'm liking it a lot. I might even give that comic podcast a listen!
(Were the last 9 minutes blank, though, or is my iPod dying?)
And you guys were way too harsh on Shantae (even though you liked it).
That said, this was a really enjoyable episode. I started tuning in after the charity show, and I'm liking it a lot. I might even give that comic podcast a listen!
(Were the last 9 minutes blank, though, or is my iPod dying?)
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #15: Nintendo DS Edition
« on: October 23, 2010, 07:18:10 PM »
All good choices, in that they are all (supposedly) quality games that I own, but haven't played. I went with Lunar Knights, just to shed a bit more light on the awesome MGS/Zelda fusion that was the first Boktai.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #14: Yoshi's Story -- Official Discussion Thread
« on: October 23, 2010, 07:16:33 PM »
Jonny:
I would never argue that the game is not opaque. I'm not saying people playing it would immediately KNOW it was the right way to play. I just thought some of the guys on the podcast disputed that 30 melons WAS the 'correct' path, but maybe I misheard.
That's fair about the controls. They're strange. I didn't enjoy Littlebigplanet for similar reasons. And I'm not really enamored of the physics in Super Meat Boy, either.
I would never argue that the game is not opaque. I'm not saying people playing it would immediately KNOW it was the right way to play. I just thought some of the guys on the podcast disputed that 30 melons WAS the 'correct' path, but maybe I misheard.
That's fair about the controls. They're strange. I didn't enjoy Littlebigplanet for similar reasons. And I'm not really enamored of the physics in Super Meat Boy, either.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #14: Yoshi's Story -- Official Discussion Thread
« on: October 18, 2010, 11:47:23 PM »
Y'all hatin'.
Good discussion (even if my beloved Yoshi got quite the drubbing). I'd argue a few points, though.
1) I think you can tell the melons are the 'right' way to play the game when you try to get all (or almost all) of the melons on a level. Most of them are linked to fun little challenges, which accounts for most of the actual 'gameplay' in the game. It seems pretty obvious that eating the first 30 fruit you see and skipping 95% of the content is the 'wrong' way to play. And the weight of the melons in the scoring also strongly indicates their importance (although not explicitly).
2) Speaking of which, I don't think the scoring system is necessarily broken. The melons are most of the score, true. But that's just the base of the score. The 'expert' score would be 30 Melons + your non-melon mastery of the level. I'm not going to pretend like I've pushed the scoring system to it's boundaries and can testify as to how rigorous it is, but I don't see anything wrong with the concept.
3) THE CONTROLS. They are slippery and squirelly. But not laggy or unresponsive. I will never believe that Nintendo just programmed them poorly or sloppily. I have to think they were intentional. And they ARE strange, but certainly manageable. Plus, they give the game just a bit more of its own identity. It's interesting that you brought up Sonic in the same episode, because I think the YS controls have some similarities with Sonic controls, in terms of the slipperiness and its divisive effect on the audience. I mean, did Yoshi really control so much different than Luigi in SMB2?
Oh, and the music is undeniably undeniable. It's like a litmus test to check who has a soul. As for the mysterious lyrics, some folks believe that what Yoshi is really singing in the main theme is something along the lines of "Ballz, look at mah ballz."
Good discussion (even if my beloved Yoshi got quite the drubbing). I'd argue a few points, though.
1) I think you can tell the melons are the 'right' way to play the game when you try to get all (or almost all) of the melons on a level. Most of them are linked to fun little challenges, which accounts for most of the actual 'gameplay' in the game. It seems pretty obvious that eating the first 30 fruit you see and skipping 95% of the content is the 'wrong' way to play. And the weight of the melons in the scoring also strongly indicates their importance (although not explicitly).
2) Speaking of which, I don't think the scoring system is necessarily broken. The melons are most of the score, true. But that's just the base of the score. The 'expert' score would be 30 Melons + your non-melon mastery of the level. I'm not going to pretend like I've pushed the scoring system to it's boundaries and can testify as to how rigorous it is, but I don't see anything wrong with the concept.
3) THE CONTROLS. They are slippery and squirelly. But not laggy or unresponsive. I will never believe that Nintendo just programmed them poorly or sloppily. I have to think they were intentional. And they ARE strange, but certainly manageable. Plus, they give the game just a bit more of its own identity. It's interesting that you brought up Sonic in the same episode, because I think the YS controls have some similarities with Sonic controls, in terms of the slipperiness and its divisive effect on the audience. I mean, did Yoshi really control so much different than Luigi in SMB2?
Oh, and the music is undeniably undeniable. It's like a litmus test to check who has a soul. As for the mysterious lyrics, some folks believe that what Yoshi is really singing in the main theme is something along the lines of "Ballz, look at mah ballz."
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #14: Yoshi's Story -- Official Discussion Thread
« on: October 06, 2010, 12:58:01 AM »
I love Roguelikes (like Rogue!). The rules of a roguelike are kind of specific (random generation is a big part of it), and Yoshi's Story probably doesn't qualify, but it definitely has kind of a Groundhog Day vibe, like Dead Rising and Breath of Fire V. Except in those games, you power up each time...
Yoshi's Story does have a weird kind of structure, but does it really differ from any dense, linear game that encourages exploration and mastery? Like even Super Mario Bros.? The difference, I guess, is that YS is a bit more (less?) explicit, with the melon thing. The elective difficulty is sort of similar to that of Wario Land: Shake It, though, as well as, apparently, Good Feel's follow-up, Kirby's Epic Yarn. Maybe those guys were big fans of Yoshi's Story? Kirby certainly has a similar aesthetic.
Starting with Donkey Kong, and even leading into Mario Bros. and Super Mario Bros., scoring actually used to be a significant part of Platformers, before they became all about getting to the end and unlocking levels. Nintendo has sort of tried to bring that back a couple of times, with Yoshi's Island, Yoshi's Story, Yoshi's Touch and Go, and Donkey Kong Jungle Beat, as well as Mario Vs. Donkey Kong. Jungle Beat had a particularly fresh scoring system, being a combo-based platformer. I'd really like to have seen how they could've expanded on that concept with a control scheme that was a bit more reliable and predictable. But, alas, we got DKCR.
By the way, someone actually did make a Roguelike platformer: Spelunky.
Yoshi's Story does have a weird kind of structure, but does it really differ from any dense, linear game that encourages exploration and mastery? Like even Super Mario Bros.? The difference, I guess, is that YS is a bit more (less?) explicit, with the melon thing. The elective difficulty is sort of similar to that of Wario Land: Shake It, though, as well as, apparently, Good Feel's follow-up, Kirby's Epic Yarn. Maybe those guys were big fans of Yoshi's Story? Kirby certainly has a similar aesthetic.
Starting with Donkey Kong, and even leading into Mario Bros. and Super Mario Bros., scoring actually used to be a significant part of Platformers, before they became all about getting to the end and unlocking levels. Nintendo has sort of tried to bring that back a couple of times, with Yoshi's Island, Yoshi's Story, Yoshi's Touch and Go, and Donkey Kong Jungle Beat, as well as Mario Vs. Donkey Kong. Jungle Beat had a particularly fresh scoring system, being a combo-based platformer. I'd really like to have seen how they could've expanded on that concept with a control scheme that was a bit more reliable and predictable. But, alas, we got DKCR.
By the way, someone actually did make a Roguelike platformer: Spelunky.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #14: Yoshi's Story -- Official Discussion Thread
« on: October 04, 2010, 06:25:08 PM »
Yeah. I think they're pretty fun, in and of themselves, but if you mess one up, it basically ruins your score. That's what I meant by punitive. I find that I got the most enjoyment from this game by exploring during my leisure and unlocking all of the levels during the early playthroughs, and then trying to Melon each stage. Going for the highest cumulative end game score could be kind of maddening, so I didn't focus on that.
Yoshi's Story is such a weird, idiosyncratic game in that the methodology of playing affects your overall experience so much. You really have to play it the right way. And the game doesn't even explicitly tell you which path to follow. So un-Nintendo.
Un-modern-Nintendo, anyway.
Yoshi's Story is such a weird, idiosyncratic game in that the methodology of playing affects your overall experience so much. You really have to play it the right way. And the game doesn't even explicitly tell you which path to follow. So un-Nintendo.
Un-modern-Nintendo, anyway.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #14: Yoshi's Story -- Official Discussion Thread
« on: October 04, 2010, 06:14:56 PM »
Yaaaay, Yoshi's Story. I love this game. Because it is so WEIRD. It's, like, a branching, linear succession of 2D open-worlds. In a lot of ways, Yoshi's Story is the fusion of the platforming of 2D Mario and the adventure-style, 'explore the environment and find challenges' gameplay of 3D Mario. And the aesthetics are amaaaaazing. It might still be my favorite-looking 2D game (far more pleasing and thematically consistent than LittleBigPlanet and an obvious antecedent of the beautiful Epic Yarn). And the music perfectly straddles the line between maddening and catchy. Even if you hate it, you're still going to remember it. That's more than you can say for most modern-ish games.
Yoshi's Story is a game that is easy to write off. It could be seen as saccharine. The difficulty is largely elective. For such an apparently simple game, it doesn't hold your hand in the slightest (although, from the perspective of the current gaming environment, I find that opaqueness rather refreshing). It stresses scoring over level completion (like the also amazing Yoshi's Touch and Go). Sniffing is... not fun (luckily, it's only emphasized in the introductory stages). Even when you DO give the game a chance and play it as the designers obviously intended adult humans to play it (high-score melon runs), the scoring system is rather punitive. One little slip-up can destroy an otherwise perfect game.
But it is such a quirky game that I still love it. I love the courage that drove its creation. Nintendo KNOWS 'the platformer'. They've proven this before and since. Yoshi's Story is like a subversion of the rules that Nintendo themselves created. It takes the movement and egg mechanics of Yoshi's Island, amps up the scoring emphasis to the billionth power, and then goes crazy with everything else. A melange of bizarre, counter-intuitive design decisions. From Nintendo. They don't all work, but they are all fascinating, nonetheless. Not everyone will enjoy this game, but everyone should earnestly try it and attempt to appreciate it. It's a strange fruit, but there's some tasty juice to be squeezed from it.
As an aside, how do you guys feel about analog control in a 2D platformer? I usually despise it, but I feel it works pretty well in YS, due to the slower pace and the design of the challenges (like the melon-balancing bits).
Yoshi's Story is a game that is easy to write off. It could be seen as saccharine. The difficulty is largely elective. For such an apparently simple game, it doesn't hold your hand in the slightest (although, from the perspective of the current gaming environment, I find that opaqueness rather refreshing). It stresses scoring over level completion (like the also amazing Yoshi's Touch and Go). Sniffing is... not fun (luckily, it's only emphasized in the introductory stages). Even when you DO give the game a chance and play it as the designers obviously intended adult humans to play it (high-score melon runs), the scoring system is rather punitive. One little slip-up can destroy an otherwise perfect game.
But it is such a quirky game that I still love it. I love the courage that drove its creation. Nintendo KNOWS 'the platformer'. They've proven this before and since. Yoshi's Story is like a subversion of the rules that Nintendo themselves created. It takes the movement and egg mechanics of Yoshi's Island, amps up the scoring emphasis to the billionth power, and then goes crazy with everything else. A melange of bizarre, counter-intuitive design decisions. From Nintendo. They don't all work, but they are all fascinating, nonetheless. Not everyone will enjoy this game, but everyone should earnestly try it and attempt to appreciate it. It's a strange fruit, but there's some tasty juice to be squeezed from it.
As an aside, how do you guys feel about analog control in a 2D platformer? I usually despise it, but I feel it works pretty well in YS, due to the slower pace and the design of the challenges (like the melon-balancing bits).
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TalkBack / Re: This Week in Awful Downloads
« on: September 26, 2010, 11:49:31 PM »
Boci's post was very interesting. I've always suspected that most of the general gaming press has no desire whatsoever to cover WiiWare and DSiWare (and, to get a bit more conspiracy-theory, the Wii and the DS). I'm not sure it's a conspiracy, though, to be honest. People just play what their peers are playing, and the gaming press is largely incestuous. It's a tiny gene pool, in terms of preferred platforms, tastes, and even opinions. And representative of only a tiny swath of the game-playing audience.
It staggers me how media personalities on podcasts go on and on about how many GREAT games there are on the XBLIndies service, but totally ignore the WiiWare and DSiWare gems, relegating the entire services to punchlines by focusing on the shovelware (which there IS quite a bit of, admittedly, but XBLIndies???). Similarly, even shitty HD games that nobody cares about will get discussed in place of flagship Wii/DS games. And it seems like the vast majority of the media would never pay to play a Wii game. They literally have to be paid in order to do it, which leads to widespread ignorance about the platform. Even wider spread, because their opinions are funneling directly into the ears of gamers. And the effect on the mainstream gaming hivemind is palpable. It even seems to affect publishing decisions, especially in the beginning of this gen.
Anyway, that's what I like about the NWR podcasts. You guys manage to carve out your own niche and be unique, just by discussing Nintendo platforms seriously and in-depth. Most other gaming podcasts are almost interchangeable.
It staggers me how media personalities on podcasts go on and on about how many GREAT games there are on the XBLIndies service, but totally ignore the WiiWare and DSiWare gems, relegating the entire services to punchlines by focusing on the shovelware (which there IS quite a bit of, admittedly, but XBLIndies???). Similarly, even shitty HD games that nobody cares about will get discussed in place of flagship Wii/DS games. And it seems like the vast majority of the media would never pay to play a Wii game. They literally have to be paid in order to do it, which leads to widespread ignorance about the platform. Even wider spread, because their opinions are funneling directly into the ears of gamers. And the effect on the mainstream gaming hivemind is palpable. It even seems to affect publishing decisions, especially in the beginning of this gen.
Anyway, that's what I like about the NWR podcasts. You guys manage to carve out your own niche and be unique, just by discussing Nintendo platforms seriously and in-depth. Most other gaming podcasts are almost interchangeable.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: Poll for RetroActive #14: N64 Edition
« on: September 23, 2010, 01:35:04 PM »
Yoshi's Story! It's a wacky, crazy, deeply idiosyncratic game with beautiful aesthetics that more people should appreciate.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: Episode 209: Dubious Magnanimity
« on: September 11, 2010, 08:48:32 AM »
Cool, more people getting turned on to PoP: TFS Wii! It's one of the few games that is better on the Wii than the HD twins. (There are quite a few franchises that are better on handhelds, though.)
To give you guys a taste of the unlockable goodness: 2.5D Prince of Persia challenges, the SNES version of the original, and Prince of Persia: Mystery Dungeon. For realz. It's basic, but still pretty cool. I loved those extras. I wish more companies included cool extra content like that. Stuff that subverts the game's rules in interesting ways.
I liked the characters in PoP 2008, but I was really disappointed in the story-telling mechanic. The way you had to stop and push the 'talk' button to hear more, I mean. My favorite part about Sands of Time was the seamless integration of dialogue. Instead of just sitting and watching, you were playing and listening. I see that game as one of the pillars of great video-game story-telling, along with Super Metroid and maybe ICO. But PoP 2008 ignored the lessons of Sands of Time, just as Metroid Prime and Other M ignored the lessons of Super Metroid.
To give you guys a taste of the unlockable goodness: 2.5D Prince of Persia challenges, the SNES version of the original, and Prince of Persia: Mystery Dungeon. For realz. It's basic, but still pretty cool. I loved those extras. I wish more companies included cool extra content like that. Stuff that subverts the game's rules in interesting ways.
I liked the characters in PoP 2008, but I was really disappointed in the story-telling mechanic. The way you had to stop and push the 'talk' button to hear more, I mean. My favorite part about Sands of Time was the seamless integration of dialogue. Instead of just sitting and watching, you were playing and listening. I see that game as one of the pillars of great video-game story-telling, along with Super Metroid and maybe ICO. But PoP 2008 ignored the lessons of Sands of Time, just as Metroid Prime and Other M ignored the lessons of Super Metroid.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: Episode 209: Dubious Magnanimity
« on: September 08, 2010, 01:14:34 PM »
Jonny, you played the WRONG version of Prince of Persia, man. I believe the Wii version does have the same subtitle, which is stupid, but it is completely different and waaaaay better (with some amazing extras, to boot). One of the best third-party games of the year and probably Ubisoft's best game on the system, for my money. A sadly overlooked gem that is certainly worth the $20 that it generally goes for these days.
The story-telling is not quite up to the same standard as Sands of Time (what is?) and it also fails to relate to the original trilogy in any meaningful way, but you DO get a sort of female 'Navi'-type companion that follows you around, and, most importantly, the game feels like something new, unlike the 360 version. Not only something new, but something that could only be done on the Wii*. It's a little unpolished, but a true diamond in the rough. Very cool game, and you owe it to yourself and your listeners to give it a try. You owe it to the Prince.
*pre-Move
The story-telling is not quite up to the same standard as Sands of Time (what is?) and it also fails to relate to the original trilogy in any meaningful way, but you DO get a sort of female 'Navi'-type companion that follows you around, and, most importantly, the game feels like something new, unlike the 360 version. Not only something new, but something that could only be done on the Wii*. It's a little unpolished, but a true diamond in the rough. Very cool game, and you owe it to yourself and your listeners to give it a try. You owe it to the Prince.
*pre-Move
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #11 Discussion: Super Mario RPG
« on: February 20, 2010, 08:08:12 PM »
Played a bit more. I guess there is a 'badge' system, although it seems a bit utilitarian, like "Wear this to prevent poison", "Wear this to prevent falling asleep", etc.
I still can't believe they went with the Congo Bongo perspective for the overworld platforming. Even successfully jumping on a save block is a challenge in spatial reasoning.
The game seems a bit longer than I expected after grabbing the first star. I feel like most of that length comes from endless battles through fairly small environments, though. Battle upon battle upon battle. Which is kind of a problem, since they feel so similar to each other and don't require any strategy, really. It gets to be a bit much, and I wish the game just cut about half of the enemies. All other things being equal, I would probably enjoy it a lot more.
Which is strange, because in Mario & Luigi and Paper Mario, I would actually seek out battles. They were almost as strategy-shy, but just felt much more impactful and arcadey.
There have been some charming bits in SMRPG (like the tadpole song), but also many clunky elements (like the tadpole song), and the cutscenes are a bit lengthy, overall. I do appreciate Mario's overall zippiness, though the game is slowed down somewhat by battle transitions/animations/epilogues/etc., a problem that is compounded when the battles start stacking up.
It is probably unfair to keep comparing Super Mario RPG to its successors, but I've heard a lot of people say that they prefer Mario RPG to the modern entries, and... nostalgia is a hell of a drug. PM and M&L outclass SMRPG on pretty much every level, particularly when it comes to combat and writing.
But it's decent. If I rented it, I probably wouldn't feel compelled to finish it, but I bought it, so I will. Folly begets folly.
I still can't believe they went with the Congo Bongo perspective for the overworld platforming. Even successfully jumping on a save block is a challenge in spatial reasoning.
The game seems a bit longer than I expected after grabbing the first star. I feel like most of that length comes from endless battles through fairly small environments, though. Battle upon battle upon battle. Which is kind of a problem, since they feel so similar to each other and don't require any strategy, really. It gets to be a bit much, and I wish the game just cut about half of the enemies. All other things being equal, I would probably enjoy it a lot more.
Which is strange, because in Mario & Luigi and Paper Mario, I would actually seek out battles. They were almost as strategy-shy, but just felt much more impactful and arcadey.
There have been some charming bits in SMRPG (like the tadpole song), but also many clunky elements (like the tadpole song), and the cutscenes are a bit lengthy, overall. I do appreciate Mario's overall zippiness, though the game is slowed down somewhat by battle transitions/animations/epilogues/etc., a problem that is compounded when the battles start stacking up.
It is probably unfair to keep comparing Super Mario RPG to its successors, but I've heard a lot of people say that they prefer Mario RPG to the modern entries, and... nostalgia is a hell of a drug. PM and M&L outclass SMRPG on pretty much every level, particularly when it comes to combat and writing.
But it's decent. If I rented it, I probably wouldn't feel compelled to finish it, but I bought it, so I will. Folly begets folly.
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Podcast Discussion / Re: RetroActive #11 Discussion: Super Mario RPG
« on: February 19, 2010, 10:07:31 AM »
So I've never played this game before, though I really enjoy the Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi serieseses. (They're pretty much the only RPGs that I can stand to play.) Started it up yesterday night, and fell asleep within about half an hour. It isn't too bad, though. I was just tired (and RPGs are boring).
My impression so far is that it almost seems like Square was already working on a game, and Nintendo paid them to insert Mario and the gang a ala Dinosaur Planet
/StarFox Adventures. I wonder why Square felt the need to create characters like Mallow and Geno when the Mushroom Kingdom already had a pretty rich cast (albeit not as rich as it is now). The whole "Smithy Gang" thing is kind of bizarre. Also, the environment feels kind of like a funhouse Mushroom Kingdom, like a Korean knockoff. Everyone looks slightly off. Like how Mario's eyes are all googly and close together (did Rare assist with the design?).
It seems that Nintendo wasn't too bowled over with Square's original contributions, either, since they seem to have disappeared into the annals of time, unlike externally-created characters like Waluigi or even Krystal. The Mario Universe particularly is such a melange of unique parts of strange origin (Doki Doki Panic, sports games, etc.). It seems odd that Nintendo hasn't done much with these characters since, even in fanservicey kind of games like the Mario & Luigi. Come to think of it, I recall seeing that the characters belonged to both Nintendo and Square, so maybe Square owns the original characters it created in the game. It's a testament to their bargaining power that Nintendo let them keep the rights. I guess they will be in limbo until Mushroom Kingdom Hearts, when a badass realistic Geno (and a badass realistic Mallow?) comes charging in all of a sudden and fanboys across the world swoon.
Anyway, because of how the areas are segmented and rather small, the adventure feels a bit less epic than it could. And unlike the PM/M&L series, Super Mario RPG seems to take itself fairly seriously. In true Square fashion, there are also a lot of moments in which control is taken away from the player. Mario is typically all about direct control. Learning through exploration (and tiny signboards), rather than narration. Well, perhaps that's untrue. The overarching 'plot' is often shown in a brief cutscene. SMRPG is definitely more cutscene-heavy, though. They even have one every time you enter an area like Bowser's Castle (or whatever that Castle is supposed to be).
Which brings us to the graphics. I remember being blown away by screenshots of this game (when it came out), but I don't know how well they've held up. The pre-rendered look is kind of dated now, and this game seems far more dithered and artifacted than something like Donkey Kong Country (perhaps because of the brighter color palette?). You can also tell it isn't a Nintendo game because of the isometric viewpoint. I don't know if that's ever been a good idea, especially in a game with platforming (even Q-Bert had difficult controls). But this game doesn't seem to require much precision when navigating the world, so it isn't too bad. And it does give the game a unique feel. The navigation doesn't really feel Mario, but the controls are decent and it's enjoyable enough to bound around. I liked the little touches, like the springy bed. It would be nice if those kinds of things lead to hidden areas and treasures, and such. We'll see.
The music has been very nice so far. No complaints. I think whoever composed that main theme is going places.
The combat is a tad underwhelming, coming from Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi, because those games take the ideas so much farther, and feel so much more tactile and satisfying. However, I can recognize that this was a pretty groundbreaking system for the time (the genesis of the best, most involving battle system in any turn-based RPG, in my opinion), and it is still an effective upgrade from the traditional RPG for me. Love the involvement, love the lack of random battles. And the lack of obvious visual/aural feedback on the timing does add a bit of challenge, even if the overall difficulty balance of the game seems to be fairly gentle (especially coming off of Shiren the Wanderer DS). I did die once, but that was more due to the lack of feedback on my low health. Still, the timing/damage model seems a bit more analog than that of PM/M&L. The leveling system seems pretty streamlined, and I haven't come across anything like a badge system. I'm not sure how deep the strategy of the game will get, but I'm guessing not very. I certainly don't mind the lack of stat-crunching, though.
So, yeah. Those are my impressions from a half-hour in. It may seem like I was just bitching, but I actually did enjoy my time with the game, and I don't regret buying it (yet). I shall continue the archaeological dig.
Oh, and I liked the little slot machine bit after some battles, but probably would've preferred a mini-game that was a bit less luck-based.
Does anyone know the development history surrounding Super Mario RPG? I've heard that Square and Nintendo weren't on the best of terms at that point in time. That might give some interesting historical perspective on the game. Plus, it would be pretty fascinating to hear about the ins and outs (and philosophical differences) of a Square/Nintendo team project. How much input did Nintendo really have?
They have recently teamed up again with Mario Hoops (what a bizarre project for Squintendo to tackle), and I guess Brownie Brown is kind of an interdimensional link between the two publishers.
My impression so far is that it almost seems like Square was already working on a game, and Nintendo paid them to insert Mario and the gang a ala Dinosaur Planet
/StarFox Adventures. I wonder why Square felt the need to create characters like Mallow and Geno when the Mushroom Kingdom already had a pretty rich cast (albeit not as rich as it is now). The whole "Smithy Gang" thing is kind of bizarre. Also, the environment feels kind of like a funhouse Mushroom Kingdom, like a Korean knockoff. Everyone looks slightly off. Like how Mario's eyes are all googly and close together (did Rare assist with the design?).
It seems that Nintendo wasn't too bowled over with Square's original contributions, either, since they seem to have disappeared into the annals of time, unlike externally-created characters like Waluigi or even Krystal. The Mario Universe particularly is such a melange of unique parts of strange origin (Doki Doki Panic, sports games, etc.). It seems odd that Nintendo hasn't done much with these characters since, even in fanservicey kind of games like the Mario & Luigi. Come to think of it, I recall seeing that the characters belonged to both Nintendo and Square, so maybe Square owns the original characters it created in the game. It's a testament to their bargaining power that Nintendo let them keep the rights. I guess they will be in limbo until Mushroom Kingdom Hearts, when a badass realistic Geno (and a badass realistic Mallow?) comes charging in all of a sudden and fanboys across the world swoon.
Anyway, because of how the areas are segmented and rather small, the adventure feels a bit less epic than it could. And unlike the PM/M&L series, Super Mario RPG seems to take itself fairly seriously. In true Square fashion, there are also a lot of moments in which control is taken away from the player. Mario is typically all about direct control. Learning through exploration (and tiny signboards), rather than narration. Well, perhaps that's untrue. The overarching 'plot' is often shown in a brief cutscene. SMRPG is definitely more cutscene-heavy, though. They even have one every time you enter an area like Bowser's Castle (or whatever that Castle is supposed to be).
Which brings us to the graphics. I remember being blown away by screenshots of this game (when it came out), but I don't know how well they've held up. The pre-rendered look is kind of dated now, and this game seems far more dithered and artifacted than something like Donkey Kong Country (perhaps because of the brighter color palette?). You can also tell it isn't a Nintendo game because of the isometric viewpoint. I don't know if that's ever been a good idea, especially in a game with platforming (even Q-Bert had difficult controls). But this game doesn't seem to require much precision when navigating the world, so it isn't too bad. And it does give the game a unique feel. The navigation doesn't really feel Mario, but the controls are decent and it's enjoyable enough to bound around. I liked the little touches, like the springy bed. It would be nice if those kinds of things lead to hidden areas and treasures, and such. We'll see.
The music has been very nice so far. No complaints. I think whoever composed that main theme is going places.
The combat is a tad underwhelming, coming from Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi, because those games take the ideas so much farther, and feel so much more tactile and satisfying. However, I can recognize that this was a pretty groundbreaking system for the time (the genesis of the best, most involving battle system in any turn-based RPG, in my opinion), and it is still an effective upgrade from the traditional RPG for me. Love the involvement, love the lack of random battles. And the lack of obvious visual/aural feedback on the timing does add a bit of challenge, even if the overall difficulty balance of the game seems to be fairly gentle (especially coming off of Shiren the Wanderer DS). I did die once, but that was more due to the lack of feedback on my low health. Still, the timing/damage model seems a bit more analog than that of PM/M&L. The leveling system seems pretty streamlined, and I haven't come across anything like a badge system. I'm not sure how deep the strategy of the game will get, but I'm guessing not very. I certainly don't mind the lack of stat-crunching, though.
So, yeah. Those are my impressions from a half-hour in. It may seem like I was just bitching, but I actually did enjoy my time with the game, and I don't regret buying it (yet). I shall continue the archaeological dig.
Oh, and I liked the little slot machine bit after some battles, but probably would've preferred a mini-game that was a bit less luck-based.
Does anyone know the development history surrounding Super Mario RPG? I've heard that Square and Nintendo weren't on the best of terms at that point in time. That might give some interesting historical perspective on the game. Plus, it would be pretty fascinating to hear about the ins and outs (and philosophical differences) of a Square/Nintendo team project. How much input did Nintendo really have?
They have recently teamed up again with Mario Hoops (what a bizarre project for Squintendo to tackle), and I guess Brownie Brown is kind of an interdimensional link between the two publishers.
19
Podcast Discussion / Re: Super Mario World - RFN RetroActive Discussion Thread
« on: August 19, 2009, 02:16:53 PM »
Yeah, a ton of people complained about the lives in games like Super Mario Galaxy, but who cares? It doesn't really detract from the game, and green mushrooms will always be a source of joy.
I wish more games still used scoring systems, though. Nintendo seems to have really shied away from that (perhaps to discourage competitive play?), unfortunately. Galaxy saves your Star Bits collected, when it should really be more of a time-based thing. Fans have WILLED scoring into the Metroid series, and Zelda has probably never had it (except for Link's Crossbow - don't miss!). Yoshi's Story had a robust scoring system, but the widespread hate towards that game probably didn't do much to encourage Nintendo to keep going down that path...
A lot of XBLA games really prioritize scoring and leaderboards, but that's where the 'arcade' comes from, I guess.
I wish more games still used scoring systems, though. Nintendo seems to have really shied away from that (perhaps to discourage competitive play?), unfortunately. Galaxy saves your Star Bits collected, when it should really be more of a time-based thing. Fans have WILLED scoring into the Metroid series, and Zelda has probably never had it (except for Link's Crossbow - don't miss!). Yoshi's Story had a robust scoring system, but the widespread hate towards that game probably didn't do much to encourage Nintendo to keep going down that path...
A lot of XBLA games really prioritize scoring and leaderboards, but that's where the 'arcade' comes from, I guess.
20
Podcast Discussion / Re: Super Mario World - RFN RetroActive Discussion Thread
« on: August 18, 2009, 05:16:24 PM »
Yay, podcast name-check. Just to clarify what I meant before, I meant mainly that SMB3 has a real purity and focus on 'use your limited set of primary tools to get to the end of the varied, obstacle-filled level'. SMW is a much looser design (probably BY design). As has been said before, it was more about exploration and discovery, finding secrets. The actual platforming itself was much less rigorous, challenging, and focused (especially with core additions such as the Cape and Spin Jump, which added a bit of slop to your primary tools). As such, you could say that it was a sort of precursor to SM64 and Sunshine's more Adventure-y design.
I contradicted myself when I spoke about Sunshine, since I enjoyed the numerous redundant methods of movement in that game. I guess the difference is the context. I never saw Sunshine as a game about 'getting to the end of the level' a la SMB3 and Galaxy. I saw it more as 'have fun screwing around in a large, virtual playground', even moreso than SM64. I mean, there are so many advanced mobility techniques in that game (like slipping and sliding, spinning around a tightrope with the jetpack, wall jumping into a spin jump into a hover), and so few places where those techniques are actually REQUIRED. That's the thing about the Spin Jump. Nintendo put it in, to the point of assigning it its own button, but they didn't weave it into the strategy of the levels too much (sort of like the Wall Jump in NSMB).
Didn't someone actually make a 2D Sunshine homage? I can't remember where I played it...
The extent to which Mario nostalgia inspires people is pretty crazy, though, from the countless clones to the Flipbook animations to the SMW level creator that people use for those crazy, auto-playing SMW levels on Youtube.
Have those been brought up in this thread yet? They seem to be based on the SMW engine.
I contradicted myself when I spoke about Sunshine, since I enjoyed the numerous redundant methods of movement in that game. I guess the difference is the context. I never saw Sunshine as a game about 'getting to the end of the level' a la SMB3 and Galaxy. I saw it more as 'have fun screwing around in a large, virtual playground', even moreso than SM64. I mean, there are so many advanced mobility techniques in that game (like slipping and sliding, spinning around a tightrope with the jetpack, wall jumping into a spin jump into a hover), and so few places where those techniques are actually REQUIRED. That's the thing about the Spin Jump. Nintendo put it in, to the point of assigning it its own button, but they didn't weave it into the strategy of the levels too much (sort of like the Wall Jump in NSMB).
Didn't someone actually make a 2D Sunshine homage? I can't remember where I played it...
The extent to which Mario nostalgia inspires people is pretty crazy, though, from the countless clones to the Flipbook animations to the SMW level creator that people use for those crazy, auto-playing SMW levels on Youtube.
Have those been brought up in this thread yet? They seem to be based on the SMW engine.
21
Podcast Discussion / Re: Super Mario World - RFN RetroActive Discussion Thread
« on: August 16, 2009, 06:29:38 PM »
I love Sunshine. It gets a lot of things wrong, but moving around in that game is such a joy that it was easily the best platformer of last gen for me. I love games with redundant move sets that allow for free, creative expression on the part of the gamer.
Delfino Plaza rules.
Delfino Plaza rules.
22
Podcast Discussion / Re: RFN RetroActive Game Nominations
« on: August 12, 2009, 11:35:55 AM »
Oh, Genesis. I'm down with Pulseman, Vectorman, or Shinobi III.
Or Beyond Oasis, so everyone can finally realize how terrible it is.
Or Beyond Oasis, so everyone can finally realize how terrible it is.
23
Podcast Discussion / Re: Super Mario World - RFN RetroActive Discussion Thread
« on: August 12, 2009, 11:34:35 AM »
Did you guys read the Iwata Asks interview where Miyamoto basically acknowledged that, in a Mario game, the enemies are just flora and fauna that exist in the world and go about their business, and Mario just murders them for existing?
Metroid is a more obvious example, but Mario is definitely genocidal.
Metroid is a more obvious example, but Mario is definitely genocidal.
24
Podcast Discussion / Re: Super Mario World - RFN RetroActive Discussion Thread
« on: August 11, 2009, 04:16:11 PM »
Angelina Jolie would probably be a better example.
25
Podcast Discussion / Re: Super Mario World - RFN RetroActive Discussion Thread
« on: August 11, 2009, 12:30:10 PM »
I love that cartoon. It's the funniest thing ever.
That may be true, the extra buttons. Sort of like a Super Tennis thing? Thinking about it, the spin jump always kind of bugged me, because I felt it was a bit uncomfortable to hit the Y button. I recently realized that I've always disliked symmetrical, diamond-shaped button layouts, where there is no centrally located 'home' button to rest your thumb on. It just feels like bad ergomomics. I should try going back and playing all of those Super NES games with the GCN Hori SNES pad, but I don't know if it would work (or map correctly).
It's funny. When I go back and think of some of my favorite games of all time, like SMB, River City Ransom, Bionic Commando, and Power Spike V-Ball (go Technos!), many of them had only two buttons to work with. It doesn't seem like a good thing, but maybe that was part of their purity.
(That said, I'm also playing through StarTropics for the first time, and that game could REALLY use another button. Or they could just utilize Select in the dungeons...)
Anylord, what do you guys think about the spin jump? I feel it's kind of symbolic of the overstuffed nature of SMW, compared to the lean, mean SMB3. I don't remember it ever being very necessary, except for spinning off of Yoshi.
I think the spin move was most likely born from the devs coming up with actions for the extra buttons. Same with the L and R level scroll feature. Which is fine by me since the spin move was integrated pretty thoroughly in the game. Yeah it was used to jump off Yoshi. But it was also a second type of jump attack, kind of a pre-butt stomp. It also made Mario invulnerable against certain enemies and hazards. So I used it a lot.
That may be true, the extra buttons. Sort of like a Super Tennis thing? Thinking about it, the spin jump always kind of bugged me, because I felt it was a bit uncomfortable to hit the Y button. I recently realized that I've always disliked symmetrical, diamond-shaped button layouts, where there is no centrally located 'home' button to rest your thumb on. It just feels like bad ergomomics. I should try going back and playing all of those Super NES games with the GCN Hori SNES pad, but I don't know if it would work (or map correctly).
It's funny. When I go back and think of some of my favorite games of all time, like SMB, River City Ransom, Bionic Commando, and Power Spike V-Ball (go Technos!), many of them had only two buttons to work with. It doesn't seem like a good thing, but maybe that was part of their purity.
(That said, I'm also playing through StarTropics for the first time, and that game could REALLY use another button. Or they could just utilize Select in the dungeons...)
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