Messages

1

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U Must Support An Equivalent of Direct X 11/Open GL 4.2

« on: October 29, 2011, 08:52:25 PM »

If the Wii U is based on the R700 series of chips as reports have suggested, that would indicate support for DirectX 10.1 SM 4.1 (only Microsoft actually uses DirectX)/OpenGL 3.3 - several revisions back. Still, supporting OpenGL and programmable shaders is already a huge leap from what they have now. They'd have to make big changes to silicon to support new features (with any reasonable speed), and trying to tack those on defeats the cost benefit of going with older tech in the first place.

The R700 is what the newer generation cards are based off of. And the Wii U started development probably right before the Wii was released. How can Nintendo support the newest tech when the cards were started back when R700 was the newest? Easy, by starting with that card and going from there. Thats why the dev kits are changing so much right now because AMD is still working on the GPU giving it the support for newer technology.

Don't worry about Nintendo graphics too much, guys. PS4 and Xbox 720 is being released in 2013 maybe late 2013. I don't think they are waiting till 2014 or 2015. And if they release in 2013, they all will be able to support same technology and engines, with the newer ones being faster but not anything noticeable.

And the reason the Wii didn't have advance graphics is because Nintendo had to make a choice, graphics or Wiimote. They didn't have the money for both. They choose Wiimote. Was it really a bad choice? Can you deny they are the winner of last generation? They were able to REUSE the same specs of the GCN Generation and sell an extra 80 or 90 million units. So they have TONS of money to spend of R&D for both control interfaces such as Wii U tablet and advanced tech inside. I mean the rumor spec is impressive. a IMB Power7 based off the Watson CPU which is very powerful. A GPU based off of R700 which is the same base for AMD's modern GPU's. So as you can see, Wii U rumored spec list is impressive. 

2

Nintendo Gaming / Wii U Must Bring it E3 2012?

« on: October 29, 2011, 08:24:13 PM »

I think Nintendo needs to bring it this E3 2012. They need to bring tons of games, both by themselves and third party developers. They need exclusives. I don't want to see only ports. That wont make gamers buy a Wii U. These games also need to look AMAZING. Next Gen like graphics. Because you know Microsoft or Sony -- or both -- will be showing at least tech demos. And those ALWAYS look better then real time graphics. So they need to make sure their games LOOK nice.

They also need something else. Showing the Wii U Controller so early means Sony can do what they always do and copy Nintendo. They all ready talked about PS Vita and PS3 doing what Nintendo has done, So if they can do something else that will totally blow away the others -- that would be good.

One thing Nintendo needs not to do is talk specific specs. We don't need to know if it has 1ghz or 6 ghz. 1GB of ram or 10GB of ram. Nor should we know officially what GPU it is. Letting Microsoft or Sony to know this, it would help them to make their specs better if they do release late 2013 or 2014.

So what do you guys think Nintendo needs to bring with them to win E3 2012?

3

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: July 22, 2011, 11:34:02 AM »

http://www.n-europe.com/news.php?nid=15926

Speaking to VideoGamer, Jay Fitzloff said that Darksiders II would be no more than a port of the 360/PS3 build. However, examining the Wii U hardware itself, Vigil seems to think that current kits are already surpassing Xbox 360 and PS3 hardware.
 

"We're not trying to bump up or bump down, but we reached it, and it wasn't hard. Once we got it up and running it was like 'cool, there it is. We're still waiting on that final hardware and architecture, and help from Nintendo to figure that out. Right now, it looks like it's more than the 360 or PlayStation 3, but there's still a question mark about how much you can squeeze out of it. You know how it is, a new system, tricks get learned as the lifespan goes along, so this is where we're starting, and it looks good."

Fitzloff also stated that Vigil are in regular contact with Nintendo seeking consultation about how best to work with the hardware.
Meanwhile, the game's director Marvin Donald has spoken to Eurogamer about Wii U. He reiterated that Darksiders II would be very much on the same level technically as the 360/PS3 versions, but went on to indicate that Wii U developer kits may still not be finalised. Donald mused that "if the Wii U turns out to be this ridiculously powerful machine", then Vigil would seek to take advantage of it in the future.

Certainly a good sign. Last gen I remember wishing that miraculously the Wii would look comparable to the PS360. Hopefully when final kits come out the U will be totally comparable the PS4/720, but even if it isn't what more do we need besides space?

 
I think the Wii U will be just as powerful as the PS4 and Xbox 1080 (I like that name beter then 720). Because if they ar released in 2012 2013 then the hardware has to be in similar place that the Wii U is in right now. And people seem to get caught up on the AMD you being an oldr on -- but every you since then has been based on th one the Wii U is based on. Basically, they can hav their own custom GPU that fits Nintendos needs.

4

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Will WiiU games be priced at $50 like the Wii, or $60 like PS360?

« on: June 20, 2011, 02:26:55 PM »

I feel like Nintendo will set their games at $50, but most 3rd parties will release at $60 since they'd have more of an "across the board" incentive. If Nintendo could keep all games at $50, then that would be a huge push to capture PS360 owners.

That be the worst choice ever. Nintendo all ready outshines everyone else on their consoles why increase that by making first party games cheaper? I know ur talking the company has a choice, but its not really a choice because being more expensive is not a good thing !!

5

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 20, 2011, 09:33:22 AM »

Would it be too costly for Nintendo to produce a multi colored LED for the Wii U? One in which the owner of the console could customize the light from green to red to blue or whatever their preference is and keep it that way. I would prefer for the system to light up in blue when I turn it on or insert a game and light up green when I get a message. I love customization, so something like this would be right up my alley.

I don't think so, but i don't think nintendo would 

6

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 19, 2011, 02:17:40 AM »

It took me far too long to do that shitty LED Disc Slot last time, so I didn't even attempt it this time.
But this is the one for me right here.


or in black....

Well, I read it and it can be reduced to this:

Just because it's possible for the WiiU to support more than one uMote does not mean that it actually will.

Summary of entire BNM argument...

If you sift through all of the cryptic PR bullshit, the most logical conclusion is that no one at Nintendo knows for sure yet.

Exactly.

....lol?

I have been saying for a while now, Nintendo will be researching games that require multiple WiiPad's. And someone at another forum made a good point... that it's possible that although it's always been possible in the hardware, that Nintendo never considered making games requiring it. Because they didn't think we would want to spend money on the controllers. And then E3 happened and ... they were proven wrong. This explains the bad PR, the dodging the question. They are or will be experimenting with concepts requiring multiple controllers, now they seen we want it.

7

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 19, 2011, 12:16:23 AM »

Well, I read it and it can be reduced to this:

Just because it's possible for the WiiU to support more than one uMote does not mean that it actually will.

No one at Nintendo has confirmed that WiiU WILL without question support more than a single tablet controller. Period. In fact, they've been dodging the question by saying that it CAN.  Well, great, but is it going to? Nintendo's most familiar faces are being extremely careful about what they say. Iwata brought up cost. Miyamoto brought up 3DS. Even Reggie, the only one of the 3 who speaks English fluently, has only gone as far as to tell Michael Pachter that WiiU CAN support 2 controllers. No real confirmation, only misdirection. Considering every tech and games website is reporting something different, you would think Nintendo would do some damage control and flatly say, "Yes, WiiU can and will support more than a single tablet controller." No such luck so far.

If you sift through all of the cryptic PR bullshit, the most logical conclusion is that no one at Nintendo knows for sure yet.

Exactly.

8

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 18, 2011, 05:12:36 PM »

"Reggie Fils-Aime had previously said that two controllers will be able to be used with the system so that laid many fears to rest but many were still scared because of Miyamoto's comments during E3. Iwata takes the sides of both of these executives. He says the system is designed for only one player and that's what Nintendo is focusing in on right now but two controllers will be able to be used. That's a good idea since the casual gamers only need one game like Wii Sports for a system to take off but hardcore gamers are the ones that keep going out and buying games. So this is probably a good idea out of Nintendo." http://www.pnosker.com/video-games/wii-games/1210-e3-2011-you-can-use-2-controllers-with-wii-u

Listen man, this is getting tiring. Yes, the hardware is not final yet. So yes, it could be changed at any rate where it would be impossible for the Wii U to have more then one controller. However, right now Nintendo is focusing on just one controller, and then 4 classic or wiimotes.

My point is they can not consider to release a game with two WiiPads unless it is going to end up with that ability. It wouldn't be in the deck of cards. They wouldn't say in the future we are looking into creating an experiance with multiple WiiPad's and researching how we can justicfiy the high price. Basically, how can we make it worth it to the consumer? They wouldn't be considering that as an option, and they wouldn't be researching that aspect, and they wouldn't be doing that "in the future", but they would be doing that right now. Unless, of course, they are planning on having the ability, but making it where at first they will focus on asymmetrical gameplay but in the future, consider symmetrical. And that should be encouraging to you that a President of Nintendo wants to give you an awesome symmetrical experiance and doesn't want to make it just normal gaming. 

9

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 18, 2011, 10:17:01 AM »

In the future means in the future. It could mean next year, next week, 6 months from now.
If they are gonna look into it in the future then that means that they didn't have any plans for it in the present, which means that the hardware may not be currently setup to support 2-4 uMote controllers.

Because your argument makes no sense. You assume that when Iwata says the future, that he's not talking about next year, but instead (I think)many years in the future. He never came out and said that the WiiU can support 4 players with individual uMotes, he said that technically the WiiU can support multiple uMotes. Well technically the WiiU could probably re-render Wii games in HD resolutions, but that doesn't mean it's gonna support the feature.
My whole argument is that Nintendo needs to make sure that the WiiU can support the extra controllers now even if they don't plan to sell them separately till some later date.

I am reading that interview as saying that, in the future, we are looking into making games that create enough value to justify buying more then one WiiPad. Thats what he is saying. And this is not the interview where he says technically it is possible. In fact, if you follow the source, you can see that is not mentioned. He mentioned in the interview, that regardless of the technical aspect, we are focusing on the game experainces we can create NOW with one controller and in the future, they might require more then one controller. They can't consider that unless it is actually possible to have more then one controller.

And Reggie did state that the Wii U can have more then one controller.

10

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 17, 2011, 11:58:31 PM »

Yup. I could go for that.

I like that too man!

11

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 17, 2011, 09:35:05 PM »

BnM, could you edit the console to be black?

No. my skillz are really limited. sorry. maybe The Perm can do it though.
I might give it a try later. I'm still teaching myself the program.

@Morbid
these are the numbers I said you had wrong

If they only make 20 dollars per WiiPad they would make $20,000 per 10,000 WiiPad's sold.

$20 x 10,000 = $200,000.


Also the numbers I had for the uMote were over $40 manufactuing. I expect them to sell it for anywhere between $65-$80 should they sell them separately.

And my point was that a profit is a profit. You're not gonna make any profit if you don't sell extra controllers. So not selling any controllers is just bad business when we know for a fact that lots of them could be sold at a profit provided compelling software is there to make use of them.

Enough value of something they do not sell? How can they consider having games that require you to play with a friend that has a WiiPad when they do not sell WiiPad's. This implies they plan on selling WiiPads. Sure, it does not go out and state it -- but they do plan on selling it. They just don't plan on games making your spend 541.991 dollars within the launch windows to enjoy the games you want to play.

So thats been my point all along. Nintendo should keep the profit they enjoy.

They don't sell but they plan on selling....? ok.
You keep saying they don't sell and not gonna sell but then say they plan on selling.... make up your mind.
I never said anything about the launch window. I'm talking about Nintendo not gimping their machine because they didn't plan on games using a 2nd, 3rd or 4th uMote from the beginning and therefore not having functionality when those games do come around.
You also said no one would buy extra controllers. I countered that with WiiFit and uPlay. So I don't know what kinda point you are trying to argue, but as long as the controllers don't cost over $100 (which I don't think they will...) then software is all they need to sell extra's. Wiimote w/ nunchuck + Motion Plus has been costing upwards of $60 since birth of the Wii, charging an extra $20 on top of that(gotta preserve those profit margins) for a uMote is not too much to ask.


and once again, I'm not saying that 2nd uMotes need to be out at launch, but the option to use them needs to be there from the get-go and selling them bundled or stand-alone will obviously be at a profit, so why not do it?

"In the future, we may look at what other opportunities there are for gameplay and, how having two of those controllers might create fun or interesting new styles of play, but of course in doing that, it would require a consumer to purchase an additional controller. Therefore, we would need to carefully consider how we could create such an experience and, potentially, how we could ensure that there would be enough value within that experience for the consumer to accept that cost and make that purchase." http://wii.ign.com/articles/117/1177013p1.html

This is what the President of Nintendo said. And I was asking you a question, let me ask you again: How can they consider in the future to require you to buy more then one WiiPads if they are not selling them? Is that possible? Your point seems to be, or one of them, that Nintendo is "gimping" themselves by not allowing it -- and Nintendo in that interview (for the first time, I might add) clearly states it is possible and that in the future games will be made BY NINTENDO that requires multiple WiiPads for multiplayer gameplay. I believe third party developers -- such as, you know, EA Sports -- will develop games requiring multiple WiiPads. I think that because if they want you to choose your plays with the WiiPad, then you can't do that without multiple WiiPad with local multiplayer gaming (one console, multiple people).

And still hung up on those numbers, are ya? If you said forty, then add forty to 24 and you get 84 dollars. Thats with the same profit margin, and that would make total cost of ownership 601.99¹. My incorrect numbers does not change my point. And I never said people won't buy more WiiPads, not specifically. I said this:

Most people start out not buying many controllers. To this day, I only bought two and the one that came with the system, and I don't have nunchucks to go with those Wiimotes, either. If they only make 20 dollars per WiiPad they would make $20,000 per 10,000 WiiPad's sold.

I wasn't stating, specifically, that people won't buy the WiiPads. I was agreeing with the person I quoted, that people don't go out and buy multiple controllers for the system when the first buy it. It's a gradual thing. It's something they do when they have money and or the need. I never bought another Xbox 360 controller the entire time I had it because I never had the need. Some people won't have the need to buy another WiiPad, so they simply won't. That won't be the majority, and it isn't an excuse not to sale WiiPad's. In fact, Nintendo is not using it as an excuse. They are simply stating that in the first year or so -- maybe longer, he said "future²" (he as in the big head huncho himself, Satoru Iwata) -- they will have multiplayer games using Wiimote and WiiPad combo's. Or classic controller and WiiPad combo's. Or WiiPad and Motion Board combo. You get the picture.

For reference, I will show you the specific post I was replying to.

Yeah, I can see how one can read it that way, but doesn't that go without saying? How many games require more than one controller? It's an odd way of phrasing it. A more appropriate way to say it would be, "WiiU will support multiple [tablet controllers] but we are not planning on releasing any games that require more than one. There will always be an option to use the Classic controller for multiplayer games as we do not want to force our consumers to own more than [the tablet controller] that comes with the console."

What it sounds like Iwata is saying is, "WiiU is perfectly capable of supporting multiple [tablet controllers] but we are not including this functionality due to cost," which, let's be honest, is total bullshit. I don't need to own 4 Wii remotes (and I don't), but I can if I want and it's certainly very expensive especially when coupled with nunchucks. Nintendo never asked anyone to invest that much money. However, the possibility is there and Nintendo let the consumer decide.

I remember reading how Nintendo originally didn't think of the nunchuck for the Wii and that the idea came from Retro Studios. Apparently, they seriously considered the Wii remote without the nunchuck. Holy lack of foresight, Batman. That said, and if Nintendo is currently planning on not supporting multiple tablet controllers since the quote is rather unclear, I hope Retro or any number of 3rd parties steps in and explains why that would be a terrible idea.

And I know you didn't say anything about the launch window, never said you did. I did, however, quote a President of a company called Nintendo who talked about the future in terms of Wii U². I assume when he said in the future, he was not talking about in 2012 Nintendo will require you to buy more than one WiiPad to play a game. And I assume when he was talking present tense he was not talking about now, considering no one has the option to buy Wii U or a WiiPad right now since ... you know ... Nintendo has not released it yet. I could be mistaken, of course.

Now finally ...

and once again, I'm not saying that 2nd uMotes need to be out at launch, but the option to use them needs to be there from the get-go and selling them bundled or stand-alone will obviously be at a profit, so why not do it?

I never said the option wouldn't be there, and I never said they shouldn't, so why ask me something we obviously agree on?


<sub>1: This number was created by an estimated cost of $349.99 for a Wii U and 3 WiiPads sold at $84. It could be more or less at final cost of ownership for a Wii U, and is not a prediction. More of a statement that Nintendo doesn't want to take all your money, at least not in 2012 and not without justifying it first.

2: IGN: Wii U Controller Price Tag Problems</sub>

12

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 17, 2011, 06:10:37 PM »

Man, I just wrote an entire post, well thought out, and I deleted it. Oh well. I have to make this one quick, running out of time.

My posts were not about Nintendo shouldn't sell the controller by themselves. The point I was trying to make is that Nintendo shouldn't have to loose their profit margin by selling them by themselves. My numbers were incorrect, but only because of lack of sources and it not really making a difference in the point. I didn't expect someone to get stuck in the numbers, and that was my fault.

So lets use your numbers. Right now you can buy a new Wiimote for like $30.

That would mean that right now, Nintendo is enjoying a $24 profit margin. These are not my numbers, these are yours and Amazons.

So with your numbers, I believe you said the WiiPad costs about $24. So then they should sell the WiiPad for at least $48. However, I still believe it costs more. The screen alone would be high. And even without a processor, the thing has to cost quite a bit more then the Wiimote. So let say it costs 40 dollars to make, then they should see it at $64. They should keep what ever profit margin they need to stay afloat. They have a percentage in their minds of what they should make, and Nintendo being a business that has last for over 100 years (almost 122 exactly) they know how to run a business better then you or I. _{Yes, Nintendo did indeed start as a company in Sept. 1889.} Whatever that percentage is, it will not change with the Wii U. Unless they believe they will sell more WiiPads. However, as I previous quoted, Nintendo is not planning on requiring gamers to buy more then one WiiPad right now. They might in the future, with an unspecified amount of time. For your benefit, I will post this quote again. Please indeed read it.

"In the future, we may look at what other opportunities there are for gameplay and, how having two of those controllers might create fun or interesting new styles of play, but of course in doing that, it would require a consumer to purchase an additional controller. Therefore, we would need to carefully consider how we could create such an experience and, potentially, how we could ensure that there would be enough value within that experience for the consumer to accept that cost and make that purchase."

Enough value of something they do not sell? How can they consider having games that require you to play with a friend that has a WiiPad when they do not sell WiiPad's. This implies they plan on selling WiiPads. Sure, it does not go out and state it -- but they do plan on selling it. They just don't plan on games making your spend 541.99¹ dollars within the launch windows to enjoy the games you want to play.

So thats been my point all along. Nintendo should keep the profit they enjoy.

_{1: This number was created by an estimated cost of $349.99 for a Wii U and 3 WiiPads sold at $64. It could be more or less at final cost of ownership for a Wii U, and is not a prediction. More of a statement that Nintendo doesn't want to take all your money, at least not in 2012 and not without justifying it first.}

13

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 17, 2011, 09:34:18 AM »

Nintendo can only keep tabs on consoles connected to the internet. They can use that data but it's inherently flawed.

I remember reading that the most recent estimates for the cost of raw parts in the Wii remote was something like $6 to $7. I looked for the source however I'm sorry to say that the pre-Webkit Blackberry browser and my work computer running IE6 with most sites blocked aren't terribly conducive for research. I was able to find out that the raw materials for the Wii console was like $160 in 2006, reduced by 45% in 2009. That said, sub-$10 cost of parts for the controller isn't all that surprising. Note that this does not include Motion Plus or Remote Plus but I can't imagine it bumping the cost up significantly. A comment on one of the sites I was browsing mentioned the price of parts at $9.83 and provided an iSuppli link that I couldn't click on so take that for what it's worth.

Assuming the WiiU controller uses the same basic parts as a Wii Remote Plus along with a 6 inch resistive touch screen, I really doubt the controller's raw parts cost more than $40, $50 tops. Nintendo could sell the tablet controller for $60 to $80. That's comparable to Playstation Move/Navigation controller and what Nintendo asked for a Wii Remote, Motion Plus and Nunchuck.

I remember reading that too, and I was unable to find a source of how much a controller costs to make. However, this controller more then likely will cost more because of that touch screen and depends on the quality -- and most people at E3 said it's a good quality. We don't know if the controller has a processor inside, and we don't even know the wireless technology they are using to stream to the controller. Could be blutooth like the Wiimote but it has not been confirmed.

However i did find a source saying the Wiimote costs 25 dollars to make, but it was on a forum, so it's prob not 100% factual.  And the cost of the Wii does not include the remote. I find that odd, you think it would have been included, but it was not.

At any rate, it is pointless to argue about prices when Nintendo is going to sell it seperately. It also matters how many they plan on making. If they make it in small supply, then it will cost more. And if they are serious on not asking you to use more then one uMote, then making them in smaller number and at a higher price makes sense.

14

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 17, 2011, 04:17:59 AM »

1st: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/104679-65-Million-Wii-Remotes-Sold-in-the-United-States
that was from Oct. of last year.
65 Million wiimotes sold in the US alone as of 8 months ago.
There are less than 45million Wiis sold in the U.S., that averages out to about 1.5 extra controllers per Wii sold in the U.S.
@ an average of $20 profit per controller, that equals $1.3Billion dollars and that is just in the US alone.

2nd: All Nintendo needs to do to ensure people buy the second remote is to make software that supports it.
uPlay anyone? Timesplitter 4^u, Mario Kart U, New Super Mario Bros U, 4 Swords U, and the list goes on and on.
They could build a 2 player UFit and the casuals would flock.
If Nintendo builds the software, then the value is already there. They just have to market it correctly.

That a 40-50 dollar remote. Double that, and see if gamers will still buy it. But you must have missed the part in my post saying NINTENDO PLANS ON SELLING THE CONTROLLER BY ITSELF and is ASKING HOW CAN THEY MAKE IT WORTH THE HIGHER price. The wiimote prob costs 25 dollars to make. This one prob costs more, anywhere from 50-60 dollars. If they sell it for 70 they make ten, 80 they make 20. but if they want the same profit margin then it will cost closer to 100 that I suggested.

And you need to read your source.

Here are the complete statistics of Wii controllers sold in the U.S. as supplied by NPD:
 

• 30.41 million included with the Wii hardware
• 12.92 million sold with  Wii Play
• 18.56 million white versions sold separately
• 2.44 million black versions sold separately
• 467,500 pink versions sold separately
• 465,200 blue versions sold separately

They sold the most with hardware. I said that would happen. They sold second amount white. Considering 30 million wii's were sold, it probably was people buying a second controller to play with friends. Third most bundled with a game. Again, I said that would happen.

I doubt Nintendo is going to sell 30 million. Look how many the Wii sold here. That smaller amount will mean less people buying them for their friends to pla with, especially if Nintendo is not going to force people to buy another one at launch to play with their friends. So you have to consider that, as well.

15

TalkBack / Re: Miyamoto Explains why Wii and Wii U are White

« on: June 17, 2011, 03:57:48 AM »

So basically he's saying that people would call the Wii U "kiddy" if they released it in a black model?  Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

*eyes his now "kiddy" PS3, 360, and PSP.*

They certainly didn't have any problems releasing the DS in multiple colors, and it's one of their best-selling products of All Time (if not THE best-selling) that had no problems appealing to all age groups.

They are saying white has more appeal then color and then just plain black. I think going white and then all black with chrome would be a good choice. Let the gamer choose.

16

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 17, 2011, 12:43:29 AM »

They aren't gonna make any profit on the controller if they don't sell it separately, so what's your point?

They bundle it in with the system, and then that's all they have sold. The ones with the system.
They sell it separately and then they stand a chance at making back that initial investment through profit from additional controllers. Even if it is at reduced profit, it's still additional profit.

To use your own example (on which your math is wrong BTW).
$20 per uMote x 10,000,000 sold is an extra  $200,000,000 that they wouldn't have had otherwise.

They aren't recouping anything if they don't sell it separately at a profit.
How do you think Nintendo made such a huge profit this gen? Alot of it was on overpriced Wiimotes which only cost them currently $6 to make.

I think your not getting my point, and thats fine my post was a bit fragmented. So I'll try to sell it again, then add some new info that will clarify this even more. Man, this is a confusing topic!! Thanks Nintendo for not doing a good job of explaining this.

Yes, they would sell some more WiiPads -- or uMote as you call it -- if they sold it separately. But they would have to sell it higher because as I explained, people don't generally buy a second or third controller. For instance, Sony doesn't reveal how many separate controller sell only how many they ship. Probably because it would look bad if they shipped 4 million but only sold 1.5 million. And if they sell more with bundles with hardware and games then they do by themselves, then what guarantee does Nintendo have they would even sell 10k of these uMotes? They know how many controllers they have sold in the first year. And total. So it's a business, they need to way the costs and the pros & cons.

However, it also needs to be said Nintendo changes their minds on a daily basis. Some of this I think is poor translation and getting to us American's it just confuses us. Any way ... here is another quote.

"In the future, we may look at what other opportunities there are for gameplay and, how having two of those controllers might create fun or interesting new styles of play, but of course in doing that, it would require a consumer to purchase an additional controller. Therefore, we would need to carefully consider how we could create such an experience and, potentially, how we could ensure that there would be enough value within that experience for the consumer to accept that cost and make that purchase."

Consider the value of something they aren't selling? How can a consume purchase something they aren't going to sell? It looks like they plan on selling the controllers, but aren't going to force the consumer to buy multiple controllers at launch and might in the future, when they figure out ways to make it worth it to the consumer.

17

TalkBack / Re: Miyamoto Explains why Wii and Wii U are White

« on: June 17, 2011, 12:12:32 AM »

Actually, that's my belief as well. Reggie worked for VH1 before Nintendo and Apple is very important to the music industry. However, the reason Apple choose white is probably a similar reason. So you know. He says tomato and we say tAmato ....

18

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 16, 2011, 11:52:58 PM »

Yeah, I can see how one can read it that way, but doesn't that go without saying? How many games require more than one controller? It's an odd way of phrasing it. A more appropriate way to say it would be, "WiiU will support multiple [tablet controllers] but we are not planning on releasing any games that require more than one. There will always be an option to use the Classic controller for multiplayer games as we do not want to force our consumers to own more than [the tablet controller] that comes with the console."

What it sounds like Iwata is saying is, "WiiU is perfectly capable of supporting multiple [tablet controllers] but we are not including this functionality due to cost," which, let's be honest, is total bullshit. I don't need to own 4 Wii remotes (and I don't), but I can if I want and it's certainly very expensive especially when coupled with nunchucks. Nintendo never asked anyone to invest that much money. However, the possibility is there and Nintendo let the consumer decide.

I remember reading how Nintendo originally didn't think of the nunchuck for the Wii and that the idea came from Retro Studios. Apparently, they seriously considered the Wii remote without the nunchuck. Holy lack of foresight, Batman. That said, and if Nintendo is currently planning on not supporting multiple tablet controllers since the quote is rather unclear, I hope Retro or any number of 3rd parties steps in and explains why that would be a terrible idea.

You have to understand that this was translated and more then likely not very well. It's possible the way he said it was correct in his language but translated incorrectly. And I can believe that. Probably very early in it's development though.

The thing is, we don't know how much this controller actually costs. Sure, Nintendo can choose to loose profit and sell it at the same price as the Wiimote/nunchuck combo ($60 dollars) but why should they? It's a business, they have to make money. And how much R&D did they spend developing this controller? I know the R&D was the reason the original Wii was not HD -- Nintendo could spend the money on HD hardware, or the Wiimote. They choose Wiimote. So if they spent over 500 million dollars in development of this new controller -- which is possible -- they have to pay for that some how. Then consider how many your actually going to sell. Most people start out not buying many controllers. To this day, I only bought two and the one that came with the system, and I don't have nunchucks to go with those Wiimotes, either. If they only make 20 dollars per WiiPad they would make $20,000 per 10,000 WiiPad's sold.

And according to Sony, with the PS3 Move controller, people generally bought the controller as a bundle -- new PS3 console or bundled with a game -- and not actually by itself. Look at this article.

So the question remains, why should Nintendo loose not only profit, but money on the actual research, for this controller? They are not Sony or Microsoft. They can't afford to loose money. They only make games and game hardware. They started out as a card company, too (random piece of info). So they aren't going to do that, and they shouldn't.

And just to show you what I am talking about look at this forum topic. http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33933013

19

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Multiple WiiU controllers are possible, but cost too much

« on: June 16, 2011, 08:21:58 PM »

Multiple Wii U Controllers Are a Cost Issue
Considerable price increase to support more than 1?
http://kotaku.com/5812512/multiple-wii-u-controllers-are-a-cost-issue

"There's a cost issue," Nintendo president Satoru Iwata told Japanese business site Diamond Online. According to Iwata, Nintendo aims to have the console and games support one Wii U Controller.

"Technically, it is possible for the Wii U to support multiple Wii U Controllers," Iwata said. However, this will result in a "considerable" price increase.

According to Iwata, "We're not planning on asking our customers to buy multiple Wii U Controllers."

source

Not supporting 2 Umotes is a very big mistake I think.
By not supporting 2 at the minimum, you are severely limiting your local multiplayer options.
Depending on what that cost is, and I'm assuming it's an extra transmitter or 3 or 4, then Nintendo should either pass part of it on, eat it outright or include an expansion port to insert extra transmitter(s) should the need ever arrive and/or the price hit the right spot.

Ofcourse I'm not in a position to know exactly what that extra cost is, but if it's just an extra $30-$50 that is preventing Nintendo from launching at that $299-$349 price point they are trying to reach, then just eat it and make it up in software and extra controller sales. (uPlay at launch solves the whole problem)

 
He said they don't plan on asking their customer to spend money on a second controller and that it is possible. Meaning they aren't going to have games to require you to have to or more tablet controllers and all local games will use the wiimote or classic controller.

20

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 15, 2011, 12:49:48 PM »

I'm more worried about the wireless technology's ability to support streaming graphics to multiple tablets than the gpu's.

Thats been my belief all along. That it was the way Nintendo is streaming the feed and not the actual hardware guts. Maybe they are saving money by keeping one feed only? Who knows...

21

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U

« on: June 15, 2011, 12:48:39 PM »

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it impossible for Nintendo (or Sony) to use DirectX since its owned by Microsoft? Even if they could, why would they want to use something proprietary when OpenGL could be used instead for free?

It's not impossible and it's not uncommon for a company to pay a license fee for something that a compeditor makes. Look at Apple, using Samsung screens for iPhone. They could choose another brand, however they want the best. And when it comes to games, generally DirectX is the best -- but OpenGL I am partial to considering I am a Mac fan and thats what we generally use.

But if the R700 is the base of all next gen GPU's, support for OpenGL 4.0 COULD have been added. We just don't know and probably never will.

22

Nintendo Gaming / Re: HOLD THE PHONE: Wii U with 2 WiiPads?

« on: June 14, 2011, 10:34:41 AM »

Hold the phone? Is that still an expression?

I'm retro like that! hahaha 

23

Nintendo Gaming / Re: Wii U the next Dreamcast?

« on: June 13, 2011, 09:12:51 AM »

I think one of the rumored spec sheets blscknmild posted had listed a 4 core but most rumors state a 3.  I guess we might not know till before or at release when someone takes one apart.

The IBM Watson CPU, which is the cpu Nintendo is using, is only made in 4, 6 and 8 variants. Which means IBM can create a special line just for Nintendo, or go the cheaper route and use the existing lines when making Nintendo processors.I think Nintendo would rather save money wouldn't you?

24

Nintendo Gaming / Re: HOLD THE PHONE: Wii U with 2 WiiPads?

« on: June 12, 2011, 02:26:04 PM »

The player doing the shooting is using a classic controller. The one placing enemies is using a Wii U remote. I was there, I saw it for myself. Other people have reported this same thing, as well.

 
I noticed that after that.

25

Nintendo Gaming / Re: HOLD THE PHONE: Wii U with 2 WiiPads?

« on: June 12, 2011, 11:18:42 AM »

OK thats cool to see, but I didn't pay much attention. Are they playing on 1 single Wii U or is it some kind of LAN?

That's my question -- is it one th same console?