Topic: REVIEWS: New Super Mario Bros. Wii

[Stele]

Also, the game bafflingly allows the team to commit suicide in co-op by accidentally pushing the A button to idle in a bubble.

This happened last night while my wife and I were playing.  It's one of the few controller-throw-inducing-rage moments I have had with the game. 

Single player, I'm loving most of the game, as much as I enjoyed the DS version at least.  I searched around, found a warp cannon on my own, and am working through world 8 already.  Mostly so I can unlock the "save anywhere" feature, which I also thought was a stupid unlock on the DS.  Then I'll probably go back and get every coin, just as I did on the DS.

The new motion platforms and twisting mechanics are spectacularly done.  It's a little bit of the old "rub your belly and pat your head" challenge, where I really have to focus on the right angle and timing my jumps.  One castle, I think world 7, has you riding a crane-like platform, while bob-ombs rain down from both left and right.  It was an intense challenge, and very rewarding when I finished it. 

Overall a great game.  But once again, the Wiimote seems to leave something to be desired.  Seems like just another button or two (spinjump, maybe separate hold/run) would make the controls perfect.  But I guess they did the best they could with what they have.

[Ian Sane]

See my previous post.

I was responding to your previous post.  They made it both so that you don't accidentally pick up your teammate.  But that would only be a problem because of the waggle because of accidental remote shakes.  Unless you're implying that people would accidentally pick up their teammate with the 1 button as well.

It's like they said "hey let's make you have to waggle to pick up an item!" and then they tested it and realized that people were accidentally picking stuff up and throwing it all over the place so they put in the button press, but didn't realize that they were essentially going back to the old classic Mario control scheme only with additional unnecessary waggle.  The whole thing reaks of trying to make sure motion control is used in some way instead of just making the ideal controls for the game.

[KDR_11k]

Ian, it's more like they tried it with just the 1 button at first but most people hold that down the whole time to keep running and picking a player up just by bumping into him while running would suck.

Con
-Well-worn graphical style

i wish Nintendo made the game look like this:

http://fc03.deviantart.com/fs38/f/2008/362/a/d/Mario_World_by_Orioto.jpg

or

http://fc09.deviantart.com/fs32/f/2008/233/a/e/Milky_Sky_by_Orioto.jpg


but Nintendo is lazy with art style in mario games. I guess they don't want to try to top Yoshi Island.

Brown!

[vudu]

Unless you're implying that people would accidentally pick up their teammate with the 1 button as well.

That's exactly what I was saying.  You'd hit thdown on accidents.e 1 button to start to run but you'd accidentally grab a nearby teammate.  Forcing you to both hit the 1 button and shake the remote reduces the likelihood of frustrating mistakes.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

INEPT PEOPLE, YOU PLAYED MARIO 20 YEARS AGO, YOU SHOULDN'T BE ACCIDENTALLY HITTING WEIRD BUTTONS BY MISTAKE.

"OH DRATS, I ACCIDENTALLY HIT SELECT, CAUSING TEAM SUICIDE.  WOE IS THIS IDIOT."

[Stele]

Then they should have just implemented the shake for picking up teammates only.

I can pick up a turtle shell with just a button, but a frozen turtle I have to pick up with a button and a shake.  What the hell kind of sense does that make? 


Anyway, beat the game.  Final boss fight was brilliant.  Actually died enough to see the super guide thing, but I was gaining a 1-up every time so I was never in danger of losing.  Now to hunt down star coins and actually be able to save after ever stage.  Yay!

[Peachylala]

INEPT PEOPLE, YOU PLAYED MARIO 20 YEARS AGO, YOU SHOULDN'T BE ACCIDENTALLY HITTING WEIRD BUTTONS BY MISTAKE.

"OH DRATS, I ACCIDENTALLY HIT SELECT, CAUSING TEAM SUICIDE.  WOE IS THIS IDIOT."

This message has been brought to you by the Pro Message System. Please take note of this, media outlets who gave this game a 7.

[Ian Sane]

That's exactly what I was saying.  You'd hit thdown on accidents.e 1 button to start to run but you'd accidentally grab a nearby teammate.  Forcing you to both hit the 1 button and shake the remote reduces the likelihood of frustrating mistakes.

Seems like overkill.  Many co-op games are arranged in such a way that one can accidentally inflict harm on your teammate.  When playing beat-em-ups with my brother inevitably someone will accidentally punch the other guy.  In first person shooters you can accidentally shoot your teammate.  Jump to high in Contra and you kill your partner (something NSMB also has).  But these games don't add unnecessary safety mechanisms to the controls.

The whole thing seems along the lines of friend codes.  Nintendo assumes the general public is far more helpless than they truly are.  Hell the whole Wii concept is based on the assumption that people are too fucking stupid to use a videogame controller which I will refute until the day I die.  Anyone who can figure out a bank machine or a microwave or an automoblie or a fucking telephone can figure out a videogame controller.

And the irony or ironies is that in Nintendo's attempt to make controls less confusing they implemented a method of picking up items that is MORE complicated than any other Mario game.

[that Baby guy]

You're comparing a simple shake of the controller, which helps give you more control over the game in a simple manner to the over-complication of Nintendo's online system?

It's pretty simple:  Anything you can jump on, walk on, or bounce off of without taking damage requires you to shake the Wii Remote in order to grab.  Anything you can't can simply be picked up with the one button.

What does that mean?  Frozen enemies become platforms you can use without having to worry about losing the platform.  The same goes with barrels, and with other players.

I like it, because it does prevent problems faced in the other games with the blocks you could pick up, and it's a simple mechanic, from my experience.

Edit:  What's so incredible is that the implementation was so seamless that most people didn't even make that connection that have complained about it.  At least, I've never seen it mentioned.  They just take it for granted, which goes to show that it works better than we've realized.

[Mop it up]

How much of the music is recycled from the DS game, and how much of it is a new composition? It's been a while since I played the DS one so I don't remember all of the music.

[Killer_Man_Jaro]

How much of the music is recycled from the DS game, and how much of it is a new composition? It's been a while since I played the DS one so I don't remember all of the music.

I've only at the castle level of world 3, so what I say isn't the full picture, but from the sounds of things:
The Overworld, Athletic and Fortress themes are taken from the DS game (and I guess you could include the famous Underground tune, which has really been taken from practically every Mario game), though 'recycled' is a spotty term. None of the arrangements in the Wii version are the same as before; it's a set remixes to those songs.
Beyond that, I think everything else is a remix from another game or a new composition. The Desert, Underwater, Ghost House and Castle compositions are new. The Map Enemy and Fortress Boss themes are from Super Mario Bros. 3, but the Castle Boss music is totally different. This isn't taking into account all the different Map Screen themes - those in the first three worlds are new pieces of music, at least.

[TheYoungerPlumber]

There are new compositions, but they don't stand out and aren't used as often as you'd expect. The remixes, including those of NSMB, are my favorite songs in the game, which doesn't sit well with me.

[AV]

How much of the music is recycled from the DS game, and how much of it is a new composition? It's been a while since I played the DS one so I don't remember all of the music.

I'm not to happy about that. That music isn't that memorable , I much rather they just recycle the music from Brawl. Brawl had some amazing remixes of mario themes.

Underworld remix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJ8CK3-SbCQ

under water remix ( it takes time to get going)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGSnsWGC9k0

and finally

remix of ground theme 2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSnpSi218Sk

Nintendo already has this music and it belongs to them. I much rather play mario game with this music than the midi music that is currently in NSMBW

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Brawl remixes are overrated and don't carry a sense of 4-player fun.

[D_Average]

Why defend the the waggle in this game? It just doesn't belong in this game. At. All.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Without waggle, you can't spin-jump.

TRY. AGAIN.

[D_Average]

Right......

These games are heavy on twitch gameplay. Waggle is not twitch. It takes far too long to respond. It's added about as much to gamng as Nickleback has to rock. It should be avoided at all costs.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

You must be one of those players that has to throw your hands+Remote into the air like a cheerleader to make it work, correct?

Last I saw, the vertical lifting action already has an inherent pause, in this game and in Super Mario Bros. 2.  That's a frequent action not critical to the twitch gameplay you're trying to generalize (I see platforming as flow, not twitch), and that action is historically a flow-breaker that leads to other key mechanics anyway.

Many of us are already accustomed to twitch-waggle, and the delay isn't appreciable enough to bother condemning.

[Mop it up]

I've only at the castle level of world 3, so what I say isn't the full picture, but from the sounds of things:
The Overworld, Athletic and Fortress themes are taken from the DS game (and I guess you could include the famous Underground tune, which has really been taken from practically every Mario game), though 'recycled' is a spotty term. None of the arrangements in the Wii version are the same as before; it's a set remixes to those songs.
Beyond that, I think everything else is a remix from another game or a new composition. The Desert, Underwater, Ghost House and Castle compositions are new. The Map Enemy and Fortress Boss themes are from Super Mario Bros. 3, but the Castle Boss music is totally different. This isn't taking into account all the different Map Screen themes - those in the first three worlds are new pieces of music, at least.

Thanks for the response. I knew of the SMB3 remixes, I just wasn't sure what was from NSMB on DS because it has been a while since I've played it.

That music isn't that memorable , I much rather they just recycle the music from Brawl. Brawl had some amazing remixes of mario themes.

Other than the underground theme from Super Mario Land, I thought the Mario remixes were pretty "blah".

[KDR_11k]

Why defend the the waggle in this game? It just doesn't belong in this game. At. All.

I'd rather use waggle than try to hit the B button in the middle of an action.

[MegaByte]

B is like hitting L.  Hitting shoulder buttons works fine in Smash Bros.

[KDR_11k]

Shoulder buttons are placed differently from B. B is intended only for when you hold the controller in one hand.

[famicomplicated]

Can you pick up without shaking in single player?

As there's no one else playing the "accidental team-mate pick up" problem wouldn't exist, no?

[that Baby guy]

If you can safely walk or bounce off of what you'd be picking up, you have to shake.  That way you can still hold the run button without fear of picking it up on accident.

[MegaByte]

Shoulder buttons are placed differently from B. B is intended only for when you hold the controller in one hand.

Tell that to all the games that successfully utilize B in sideways mode.