Topic: Twilight Princess gameplay screens vs Spaceworld 2000 GCN Zelda demo

[airraid]

when I saw the new gameplay screenshots of Legend Of Zelda:  Twilight Princess, I was immediately reminded of the old Spaceworld 2000 demo from over 6 years ago, because of that big sword the knight is holding--it looks similar to the one Ganondorf had in the demo.



realtime demo Spaceworld 2000, 60 frames per second




.
.

Twilight Princess gameplay, ~30 frames per second






oh and also....



Soul Calibur II Gamecube prerendered CGI intro



Twilight Princess realtime cutscene



I like the new close up of the Master Sword, it looks even cooler than the one in the SCII GCN intro  


so...... what do you think ?

well anyway, I wish I didn't have to wait almost 3 months for the Gamecube version of Twilight Princess. it's almost as if Nintendo doesn't want to talk about it.  I'll be getting both versions anyway, but I might get the Gamecube game first, then the Wii version.  haven't made up my mind yet.  in the mean time, what else is there to do ?   oh yeah, finish playing TWW  

[Artimus]

It's amusing how bad Link looks in retrospect, and how much more impressive GameCube games look now versus then.

[airraid]

yes and no.

technically speaking Link looks and animates better in the spaceworld demo. technically the graphics are more advanced. there are more polys, better animation, stronger lighting, and it runs at about twice the framerate.

with that said, the art direction and overall look of Link in Twilight Princess is much better.

which proves that artwork can make something look better than something that is technically more advanced.

[IceCold]

Those are Wii screenshots.. Miyamoto did say that graphics were the lowest priority in the conversion, but I still expect the GameCube version to look a bit worse than that. It will still be an incredible game visually, but I'm just pointing the fact out..

[airraid]

yes they are Wii shots but I don't expect the GCN version to look any different, other than the lack of 16:9 widescreen.


IIRC, Miyamoto said he told the development team *not* to spend time upgrading the graphics of the Wii version, but rather, adding additional content (maybe dungeons, areas) to both versions and making use of the Wiimote controls in the Wii version.

[wandering]

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technically speaking Link looks and animates better in the spaceworld demo. technically the graphics are more advanced. there are more polys, better animation, stronger lighting, and it runs at about twice the framerate.

the textures really suck, though.

[ShyGuy]

I like them both, but I'm not a graphics whore.  

[jasonditz]

I don't see the improvement, personally... is it because there are a bunch of unneccesary patterns on the sword guy's outfit that weren't on ganondorfs?

The top one looks a little more cartoonish, but I don't see it as inferior, personally.

[Hostile Creation]

Are you kidding me?  I'm not big on realism in graphics, necessarily; for instance I loved Wind Waker.  But the graphics in Twilight Princess blow Soul Calibur and the demo out of the water.  They're more technically advanced, with more details and better effects and yes, bunches of unnecessary patterns.  Those patterns make up what we call art direction, visual artistry, and it puts the demo to shame.  The artistic direction in Twilight Princess is nothing short of incredible, something those other two lack severely.
You're blind or stupid if you think the two are basically the same.  It has nothing to do with cartoonishness, either.  The cartoonishness isn't intentional cartoonishness, but the result of inexperience with the technology and a rushed artistic approach.
I'm very much gameplay over graphics, but I might also point out that Twilight Princess is the only playable game of the three (one being a demo and another being CGI cutscene).  You've got to appreciate the effort put into Twilight Princess over the other two (in art and technology).  It's simply better.  I'm hardly even considering this a matter of opinion.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Ehhe, I think the TP graphics look superior, I just love how everything runs together. Personally I am finding TP to be one of the most impressive games visually even compared to Xbox 360 because of its art direction and visuals, that is coming from someone who has played alot of Xbox 360's "finest" graphical impressive games. Also like Hostile said, Zelda TP is the only Zelda game that is playable.

[jasonditz]

I don't really see that well (so I guess I go into the blind category, though not legally so), so even when it's blown up on a big computer monitor I can't really distinguish graphics differences unless they're very pronounced. Maybe it's easier to see when they're moving or something, but I don't see it. I personally like the Spaceworld style better, because the characters stand out more from the background and the brighter colors make it easier to distinguish what's what.

I'm still not sure though... is this all "better graphics" have to offer us at this point is needlessly busy patterns on clothing? That doesn't seem worth it to me.

[Hostile Creation]

I didn't mean to sound harsh, it's just kinda surprising that you can't really note the difference all that well.

And yeah, graphics are basically expanding what can go on at one time, how impressive it can look, how detailed everything can look while running at optimum speed.  I don't consider it needlessly busy patterns, but an intimacy of detail.  Pikmin has few if any patterns in it, but the graphics are very crisp, defined; you have one hundred Pikmin running around at one time yet everything runs smoothly, and you can still see the cracks in the dust.
To each his own, though.

[jasonditz]

I can see that there are added details, but unlike Pikmin (which I agree looked amazing) it seems like a lot of the details here are for details' sake alone. Like every shield has to have a bunch of etchings on the front of it, and every suit of armor has to look like every inch of it was doodled on by a kid with an attention disorder.

Sometimes a window is just a window, it doesn't need to be an opportunity to show off all our real time lighting effects.

[airraid]

uncut 24 sec video of the Zelda Spaceworld 2000 demo

http://youtube.com/watch?v=VCW2nYeEPt8

[Bill Aurion]

I pretty much agree spot-on with everything Hostile said... =D

Twilight Princess exceeds everything the SpaceWorld demo had to offer except 60 FPS, but there was also nothing else on the screen in the SW demo either...

[Athrun Zala]

yep, I agree with Hostile...

the only other thing besides 60fps that demo seems to have is AntiAliasing (or maybe it's just a post processing effect.....)

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

More like NONE OF YOU have seen a pristine copy of the SW footage to make accurate assessments.  Youtube pretty much defeats any porpoises of any porpoise.

[vudu]

More like YOU NEED to upload a high resolution version to your website JERK.

[Ceric]

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Source: Merriam Webster
1 : any of a family (Phocoenidae) of small gregarious toothed whales; especially : a blunt-snouted usually largely black whale (Phocoena phocoena) of the North Atlantic and North Pacific that is five to eight feet (1.5 to 2.4 meters) long
2 : DOLPHIN 1a(1)

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I'm confused by that Pro.

Anyways.  I can definitely see why they choose to go with the Wind Waker are style now.
The TP pictures feel like everything fits together better.
Oh I am also hoping you don't start with the Master Sword.  I've been wanting a Zelda game that did the original progression, Wood, Silver, and then Master.

[IceCold]

He meant to say "purpose" in a strange accent..

[Athrun Zala]

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Originally posted by: vudu
More like YOU NEED to upload a high resolution version to your website JERK.

seconded except the jerk part =P

has something happened to your site Pro? for some reason I can't enter it anymore..... :/

[ThePerm]

iv had a 640x480 copy of the sw2000 demo in quicktime in years....twilight princess puts that video to shame. The original had alot of stuff moving on in the backround and the self shadowing was impressive...but man look at the draw distance in the new videos..and the textures!!! I would say they both have their plusses and minuses..but damn do i love twilight princess's art style.

also, there are some laughable things on the original video like when ganon moves his arm and like the texture of his armor shifts and it looks stupid. I see armor moving and shifting as armor should in twilight princess

[Kairon]

In the SW2K demo, Link was Japanese Androgenous and I think he looks like a girl.

In TP, link is given a bit of a wider face, and his features are more Japanese male. In fact, I'll go ahead and say that I believe that TP Link is the most masculine that Link has ever been.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

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Originally posted by: Athrun Zala

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Originally posted by: vudu
More like YOU NEED to upload a high resolution version to your website JERK.

seconded except the jerk part =P

has something happened to your site Pro? for some reason I can't enter it anymore..... :/

There were some domain issues.  I've updated the link in my sig just now.

[Hostile Creation]

"In TP, link is given a bit of a wider face, and his features are more Japanese male. In fact, I'll go ahead and say that I believe that TP Link is the most masculine that Link has ever been."

Interesting point, but really you're only comparing it to Ocarina of Time.  It's unfair to judge most Zeldas (including Wind Waker and Majora's Mask) because they were children, and children are childlike rather than masculine or feminine or androgynous (they are the latter, but in another sense).  Before 3D, Link is either a child or too abstract in appearance to really determine a trait such as masculinity.
In regards to OoT Link, though, probably so.  But he was a kid in half of that anyway